Consciousness

Rosco..Jones

Member
Messages
363
I am having a discussion with Harte on The Theory Of Everything thread and thought I should repost this bit here also.

Harte, Thanks for clarifying this on the T.O.E. being for subfields of Physics.
I've found a good article on quantum biology, that includes the quantum side of consciousness.
I may just get to sneak my metaphysics pack into the BIG TOE through the back door.
Here are a couple clips to introduce the subject matter.
I hope you enjoy reading it.

Remarkably, photosynthesis appears to derive its ferocious efficiency not from the familiar physical laws that govern the visible world, but from the seemingly exotic rules of quantum mechanics, the physics of the subatomic world. Somehow, in every green plant or photosynthetic bacterium, the two disparate realms of physics not only meet but mesh harmoniously. Welcome to the strange new world of quantum biology.

http://discovermagazine.com/2009/fe...-your-thoughts/article_view?b_start:int=1&-C=

QUANTUM TO THE CORE
Stuart Hameroff, an anesthesiologist and director of the Center for Consciousness Studies at the University of Arizona, argues that the highest function of life—consciousness—is likely a quantum phenomenon too. This is illustrated, he says, through anesthetics. The brain of a patient under anesthesia continues to operate actively, but without a conscious mind at work. What enables anesthetics such as xenon or isoflurane gas to switch off the conscious mind?

Hameroff speculates that anesthetics “interrupt a delicate quantum process” within the neurons of the brain. Each neuron contains hundreds of long, cylindrical protein structures, called microtubules, that serve as scaffolding. Anesthetics, Hameroff says, dissolve inside tiny oily regions of the microtubules, affecting how some electrons inside these regions behave.

He speculates that the action unfolds like this: When certain key electrons are in one “place,” call it to the “left,” part of the microtubule is squashed; when the electrons fall to the “right,” the section is elongated. But the laws of quantum mechanics allow for electrons to be both “left” and “right” at the same time, and thus for the micro­tubules to be both elongated and squashed at once. Each section of the constantly shifting system has an impact on other sections, potentially via quantum entanglement, leading to a dynamic quantum-mechanical dance.

It is in this faster-than-light subatomic communication, Hameroff says, that consciousness is born. Anesthetics get in the way of the dancing electrons and stop the gyration at its quantum-mechanical core; that is how they are able to switch consciousness off.

It is still a long way from Hameroff’s hypo­thetical (and experimentally unproven) quantum neurons to a sentient, conscious human brain. But many human experiences, Hameroff says, from dreams to subconscious emotions to fuzzy memory, seem closer to the Alice in Wonderland rules governing the quantum world than to the cut-and-dried reality that classical physics suggests. Discovering a quantum portal within every neuron in your head might be the ultimate trip through the looking glass.
 
Messages
175
Christ Consciousness - a concept of spiritual trancendance and awareness with the prime creator or source. Also a higher awareness of being. Spiritual enlightenment, a spiritual union, and Divinity. Also related to as objective consciousness or cosmic consciousness.
 

Rosco..Jones

Member
Messages
363
Donny the Dog Genius

Donny takes his toys and arranges them in geometrical patterns, different combinations and alignments.
Does he do this consciously or not?

I am a great believer in animals having consciousness, reasoning/learning abilities and emotions.
If you have ever had a dog, I'm sure there was some level of communication between the two of you.

One last side note:
Have you ever wondered why man's best friend doesn't talk?
If you don't know, just ask your wife/girlfriend.
 

Peregrini

Member
Messages
465
Perhaps one of the most famous smart animals was Alex the African Gray Parrot.

Related story:
http://www.123compute.net/dreaming/knocking/alex.html
I can't say these animals have consciousness but there is certainly something extra going on in these exceptional cases.
There is no scientific basis for my following statement. It is just a fanciful comparison but I would "guesstimate" that what Alex is accomplishing with a walnut sized brain would be the equivalent to a human having total recall of the entire Encyclopedia Britannica. Just as we have Mathematical or Musical Savants in humans, perhaps there are savants among other species?
 

Rosco..Jones

Member
Messages
363
Koko the gorilla has more than 1,000 signs. She watches TV and does not watch the sad parts. Then she explains why. She has also learned to lie.

http://www.koko.org/world/kokoflix.php?date=2011-06-18

Learning to communicate with people has to involve some sort of consciousness. There are different types of consciousness. Take the dolphins. They talk to each other, work together to catch fish in a more efficient way, assist humans in trouble etc. Even octopus' can figure out how to solve problems and learn by watching others.

On the Savant comment. Having a Savant wound mean that others are not so skillful. I just can't visualize having a genius and all others being complete idiots. Statistically, that would be an unacceptable distribution. So, between the genius and the complete idiot, we would have a range of skill levels. This would form a standard distribution Bell curve. However, the average could be very low and our Savants out at the extreme low probability portion of the curve. But, I do still feel that animals are conscious, but at different levels and suited to there needs.
 

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