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Spirituality & Mysticism
Hell, Tartarus, Hades... Let's think about this.
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<blockquote data-quote="Justinian" data-source="post: 63402" data-attributes="member: 923"><p>See.. This is all the dilemma I think most of us who are not believers have pondered. Regardless of what people think, Atheists and non-believers do read about religions. But for myself I like to figure out why. Most religions come down to some sort of faith. But, to figure out who, what, when, where, why, and how WITHOUT just saying you have to believe and have faith.. that's what I like. I know that discussions like this usually get heated, and MOST of the time it's not out of arrogance on either side, it's just frustration. On one side you have the religious believers. They have their religion and there's absolutely 100% nothing wrong with that.. TO A POINT(I include that in caps to emphasize that killings, stonings, ancient beliefs in older beliefs like this need to be reviewed by the establishments). On the other side you have people like me that just want to learn about how things came about and what their purpose is. Granted there are those that just like to argue for the sake of argument.. But, For the first two sides that I mentioned it does get really frustrating trying to make the other side understand. Not meaning make them believe your ways, just understanding why you do what you do.</p><p> </p><p>When I was in my military training school, we'd always discuss a lot of weird subjects like those posed here in these forums. I'd usually bring them up, but whatever it takes to get people's minds off of being away from family right? .. So we get into a discussion on religion one day. It had the entire class embroiled in it. Now keep in mind that there were probably 20 of us and all but 2 were Atheist or at least on the fence about their beliefs. So it's 18 vs 2. The one guy was a really funny guy. He was "special" let's say. Now we're all electronics specialists which mean we understand how electricity is made, how that is converted into frequencies and on and on.. basically we all like to understand how things work down to the last detail. So this discussion has carried on for most of our lunch break and finally.. the smarter out of the two believers says.. to us all to listen up. Then he asks me, how do I know the Civil War was real.. So I say well there are books and pictures. So he says, ok. Then how do you know that the Revolutionary War was real? So I say well we have books and letters from people that were there. He says.. Exactly! None of us were there so we can't know for sure. BUT, we basically have faith and rely on those letters and books to be true to their word. He said.. That's what faith is. It's relying on the Bible and the words within to be true to their word. This is how I've always understood where Xians were coming from.</p><p> </p><p>Now, back on target. I think we've asked a lot of Sam and we do thank you for your answers. You seem to be the only one here that was willing to step up and answer the questions of everyone here. It would have been really interesting to get some believers in other faiths to come explain answer from their point of view though. (I was going to put the little devil emote here, but there isn't one) Hope everyone is having a good New Year. I'm sure this is going to be one of those topics that goes on forever as I'm always reading and always need some place to put down questions.. Forums are lovely places for that.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Justinian, post: 63402, member: 923"] See.. This is all the dilemma I think most of us who are not believers have pondered. Regardless of what people think, Atheists and non-believers do read about religions. But for myself I like to figure out why. Most religions come down to some sort of faith. But, to figure out who, what, when, where, why, and how WITHOUT just saying you have to believe and have faith.. that's what I like. I know that discussions like this usually get heated, and MOST of the time it's not out of arrogance on either side, it's just frustration. On one side you have the religious believers. They have their religion and there's absolutely 100% nothing wrong with that.. TO A POINT(I include that in caps to emphasize that killings, stonings, ancient beliefs in older beliefs like this need to be reviewed by the establishments). On the other side you have people like me that just want to learn about how things came about and what their purpose is. Granted there are those that just like to argue for the sake of argument.. But, For the first two sides that I mentioned it does get really frustrating trying to make the other side understand. Not meaning make them believe your ways, just understanding why you do what you do. When I was in my military training school, we'd always discuss a lot of weird subjects like those posed here in these forums. I'd usually bring them up, but whatever it takes to get people's minds off of being away from family right? .. So we get into a discussion on religion one day. It had the entire class embroiled in it. Now keep in mind that there were probably 20 of us and all but 2 were Atheist or at least on the fence about their beliefs. So it's 18 vs 2. The one guy was a really funny guy. He was "special" let's say. Now we're all electronics specialists which mean we understand how electricity is made, how that is converted into frequencies and on and on.. basically we all like to understand how things work down to the last detail. So this discussion has carried on for most of our lunch break and finally.. the smarter out of the two believers says.. to us all to listen up. Then he asks me, how do I know the Civil War was real.. So I say well there are books and pictures. So he says, ok. Then how do you know that the Revolutionary War was real? So I say well we have books and letters from people that were there. He says.. Exactly! None of us were there so we can't know for sure. BUT, we basically have faith and rely on those letters and books to be true to their word. He said.. That's what faith is. It's relying on the Bible and the words within to be true to their word. This is how I've always understood where Xians were coming from. Now, back on target. I think we've asked a lot of Sam and we do thank you for your answers. You seem to be the only one here that was willing to step up and answer the questions of everyone here. It would have been really interesting to get some believers in other faiths to come explain answer from their point of view though. (I was going to put the little devil emote here, but there isn't one) Hope everyone is having a good New Year. I'm sure this is going to be one of those topics that goes on forever as I'm always reading and always need some place to put down questions.. Forums are lovely places for that. [/QUOTE]
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