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Philosophy, Metaphysics & the Afterlife
What is the bare minimum needed to be conscious?
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<blockquote data-quote="Beholder" data-source="post: 256665" data-attributes="member: 14640"><p>Intelligence is like having a calculator in your head. It can instantly be taken away by a disease, yet you are still very much conscious and feeling, even if you can't recall any memories nor make any thoughts. I remember when I had amnesia with a tropical fever, which made it clear to me that sensations and calculations have no relation. The idea that higher calculations are needed to feel anything, is only a superiority complex grown out of evolutional needs for a lack of empathy.</p><p></p><p>When a larva is eaten alive, it cries just like a human child would at the same frequencies. Plants cry in 20000-100000 Hz when in pain, so human hearing in 20-20000 Hz evolved to hear everything except the painful screams from plants. Some say that plants can't feel pain because they don't have dedicated pain nerves, but human nerves use extreme values and contradictory signals to transmit pain, not dedicated nerves. Some say that plants can't feel pain because their responses are reflexes, but the same can again be said for humans, because the pain does not even reach the brain before sending a reflex response to muscles. Our consciousness might not even reside in the brain. Just like a nerve only transmits data, calculations only transform that data, and memory only store it. So far, there is nothing that objectively sets humans apart in the ability to feel. Without the brain, we can't remember having been conscious, but we might still have been conscious without the brain recording it.</p><p></p><p>Anyone worried about this can just stop mowing the lawn and start to eat fruits, mushroom (the visible part above ground is a fruit), berries, nuts, seeds, and animals dying of natural causes. Ethical wheat must be collected without harming the plant. A tree stuck in the wrong place might have to be moved or killed in order to end its suffering.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Beholder, post: 256665, member: 14640"] Intelligence is like having a calculator in your head. It can instantly be taken away by a disease, yet you are still very much conscious and feeling, even if you can't recall any memories nor make any thoughts. I remember when I had amnesia with a tropical fever, which made it clear to me that sensations and calculations have no relation. The idea that higher calculations are needed to feel anything, is only a superiority complex grown out of evolutional needs for a lack of empathy. When a larva is eaten alive, it cries just like a human child would at the same frequencies. Plants cry in 20000-100000 Hz when in pain, so human hearing in 20-20000 Hz evolved to hear everything except the painful screams from plants. Some say that plants can't feel pain because they don't have dedicated pain nerves, but human nerves use extreme values and contradictory signals to transmit pain, not dedicated nerves. Some say that plants can't feel pain because their responses are reflexes, but the same can again be said for humans, because the pain does not even reach the brain before sending a reflex response to muscles. Our consciousness might not even reside in the brain. Just like a nerve only transmits data, calculations only transform that data, and memory only store it. So far, there is nothing that objectively sets humans apart in the ability to feel. Without the brain, we can't remember having been conscious, but we might still have been conscious without the brain recording it. Anyone worried about this can just stop mowing the lawn and start to eat fruits, mushroom (the visible part above ground is a fruit), berries, nuts, seeds, and animals dying of natural causes. Ethical wheat must be collected without harming the plant. A tree stuck in the wrong place might have to be moved or killed in order to end its suffering. [/QUOTE]
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What is the bare minimum needed to be conscious?
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