Debunking Who Perpetrated the John Titor Hoax?

[Peregrini]

Facts need no interpretation, they speak for themselves, Mr Peregrini. In Conviction of a Time Traveler all I do is present the evidence that did not yet exist in 2000 and had lay undiscovered until then. I allow the reader to draw their own (unavoidable) conclusions. As a matter of fact, I make it quite clear that no contortions of logic are required. Plain speaking facts are all they are, though admittedly, some chapters did get a little technical, say the Optical Frequency Comb section.
Now that I know that Titor was a real time traveler (supported by evidence leading to only one conclusion), I have taken to preparing for the inevitable event that will fundamentally change this world. And, unfortunately, it will happen soon. The book's aim was to do one thing really, and one thing only: to present the actual evidence to people who are curious enough about what Titor claimed and combat the careless debunking done by others in the previous 12 years.
If I knew the truth (as I understood it at the time), how could I not tell the world that 12 years of debunking by intellectually dishonest people was untrue?

And more quotes from your previous posts....

All this, and yet you are still unable or unwilling to proffer your evidence.

Seriously, Peregrini: is this all there is to your argument against Titor? Attacking the messenger?

I have not engaged in an argumentum ad hominem. I have not attacked the messenger. I say the "message" is an informal fallacy. That you have made it "your" message makes you feel it is personal. I assure you it is not.

My, my, Peregrini. You certainly are the gift that keeps on giving.

And I like you too.

In response to your assertion that I was somehow hiding my small book project in some way, allow me to say that this is a no-win situation.
If I were to announce ahead of every post that I had written a book answering all the questions we have all had about the Titor story (which is exactly what my book does), any statement or piece of evidence I provided would be seen through the prism of "commericalism" or shameless profiteering and self promotion.
If, on the other hand, I do not mention the book and simply participate in the debate, I am now accused of hiding my book; luring unsuspecting readers into buying the book somehow by not promoting it.
So which would I rather be seen as? A shameless self promoter or a nefarious "hider" of my book? The latter most definitely argues against the former I would say. Nonetheless, I chose to not make the book an issue, (the facts DO speak for themselves after all). The link to the book's website has always ever been part of my signature, so I doubt I could credibly be accused of "hiding" my involvement in my own book.

There have been several posters who came here and posted info and a link to their books, or websites and they were not attacked. Most were welcomed by several of the regular posters as well as our Admin. Numenorean7

Yes, Titor's purported mission to 1975 has never been confirmed. The evidence that I discovered far overshadowed the quirks in the 5100 (only one of which you seem to be aware of), thus rendering the 5100 portion of the story just that, a portion.

Actually, Titor's first post at anomalies.net says;

Posted by John Titor on 01-27-2001 12:45 PM
Greetings. I am a time traveler from the year 2036. I am on my way home after getting an IBM 5100 computer system from the year 1975.

I see the believers constantly saying that Titor's predictions have come true, therefore he is a time traveler.
So many Titor enthusiasts make him out to be a prophet from obscure predictions that haven't occurred but the followers make events fit their fantasy.

Posted by John Titor on 02-08-2001 01:18 PM
I would characterize world politics as two boxers who have just gone multiple rounds and they’re both pretty beat up. I’m sure someone out there wants to kill us but no one is very organized yet. There is a great deal of fear over rogue groups coming across un-launched missile systems, 55 gallon drums of Anthrax or portable nuclear weapons.
((Korea United?))
I guess you could say that. Taiwan, Japan and Korea were all “forcefully annexed” before N Day.
I don’t remember a great deal about media coverage during the civil conflicts. I would probably characterize it the same way you see coverage of Waco, Ruby Ridge and Elian Gonzalez.
From my viewpoint, yes, this is an alternate timeline. From your viewpoint, no.
I have thought again about how to revel information that would make me more believable but I always come across the following problems:
1.All of you become much less interesting as sheep. I can’t talk to you if you’re not skeptical.
2.Anything I say could be acted on beforehand and changed anyway.
3.All the really interesting information is months or years away and I’d be gone when it happens.
4.I find it morally wrong to assist someone with anything where they might gain and someone else would lose or die.
5.There’s a slim chance your worldline is just different enough my “prediction” won’t happen.
6.I simply don’t know.
Consider that you are a time traveler who goes back in time to the first week of February 1970 and you are confronted with the same problem. What do you remember right now about the second week of February 1970? Naturally, the conflict in Vietnam and the Middle East come up but as someone has already stated here, “that’s old news”. I suppose I could predict the failure of Apollo 13 spacecraft but since time travel is ridiculous, I would be blamed for sabotage. I might even decide to tell you about an earthquake in Peru but then people that would have died by chance will now live and vice versa.
All I can think of is to make something up. So here goes…. The space shuttle mission may or may not have a problem connecting the new lab to the space station.
How was that?

On 02-08-2001 Titor is able to reference these past occurrences:
"The Waco siege" began on February 28, 1993, and ended on April 19
"Ruby Ridge" occured betweenAugust 21 to 31 1992
"Elian Gonzalez" was taken by Federal agents April 22, 2000. He was returned to Cuba June 28, 2000.
Then:

Posted by John Titor on 03-24-2001 06:19 PM
I will be leaving this worldline shortly and this will be my final post. There are only a handful of people who will know exactly when I will be leaving and I’m sure they will let you know when I’m gone.

Titor's final post. Less than 6 months before the Nations greatest tragedy since Pearl Harbor. He makes no reference to it even in the most oblique manner possible. He could have said only that a great catastrophe would occur soon. Two buildings will be destroyed. There would be no way of knowing what it might be or how to avoid it.
Ah yes, this is where the oh-so-convenient alternate time line comes in to play.
So, it is Titor's story that I believe is false. Your interpretation of it is just that...your Interpretation...nothing more.

 

[Ren]

Ren said;

All I can say is, there is nothing wrong with perpetrating a hoax on the Internet,

Imagine that! Coming from you even.
BTW, you lifted these comments directly from the link you just posted, here.
I Will now Debunk John Titor 1 | Paranormalis
When work is NOT original you should make some attempt to credit the source.

O.k. I'll list the sources again in this thread too.
HOAXHUNTER - Investigating and Exposing Hoaxes (Hoax Hunter): JOHN TITOR RAZIMUS REPORT (REVISED: FEB 25th)

 

[PamelaM]

wow peregrini. you sure do assume alot on the very little bit of info you have on John.
especially assuming John knew nothing of 911 just because he didnt post about it.
I, for one am VERY happy he didnt post about it. You have very little information on what posting
about such an event would cause for other people or you just dont care.
John Titor posting was twelve years ago. You never knew John. You never spoke with him.
You never met anyone else on the team. You do not have info on any current info. you are simply
relying on information in posts from twelve years ago. Most of which served a purpose that doesnt even
involve you at all. I think John himself would probably get sick of reading the same regurgitated arguments over and over and over.
Nobody really gives a hoot if you believe John was a real time traveler or not.
No...I really have no interest in talking to you beyond this post. I hate to say this but the truth is John Titor just didnt end when
he stopped posting online. I just posted this because it simply AMAZES me that people think they are an expert on John and simply
dont know shit beyond his postings.

 

[temporal recon]

Facts need no interpretation, they speak for themselves, Mr Peregrini. In Conviction of a Time Traveler all I do is present the evidence that did not yet exist in 2000 and had lay undiscovered until then. I allow the reader to draw their own (unavoidable) conclusions. As a matter of fact, I make it quite clear that no contortions of logic are required. Plain speaking facts are all they are, though admittedly, some chapters did get a little technical, say the Optical Frequency Comb section.
Now that I know that Titor was a real time traveler (supported by evidence leading to only one conclusion), I have taken to preparing for the inevitable event that will fundamentally change this world. And, unfortunately, it will happen soon. The book's aim was to do one thing really, and one thing only: to present the actual evidence to people who are curious enough about what Titor claimed and combat the careless debunking done by others in the previous 12 years.
If I knew the truth (as I understood it at the time), how could I not tell the world that 12 years of debunking by intellectually dishonest people was untrue?

And more quotes from your previous posts....

All this, and yet you are still unable or unwilling to proffer your evidence.

Seriously, Peregrini: is this all there is to your argument against Titor? Attacking the messenger?

I have not engaged in an argumentum ad hominem. I have not attacked the messenger. I say the "message" is an informal fallacy. That you have made it "your" message makes you feel it is personal. I assure you it is not.

My, my, Peregrini. You certainly are the gift that keeps on giving.

And I like you too.

In response to your assertion that I was somehow hiding my small book project in some way, allow me to say that this is a no-win situation.
If I were to announce ahead of every post that I had written a book answering all the questions we have all had about the Titor story (which is exactly what my book does), any statement or piece of evidence I provided would be seen through the prism of "commericalism" or shameless profiteering and self promotion.
If, on the other hand, I do not mention the book and simply participate in the debate, I am now accused of hiding my book; luring unsuspecting readers into buying the book somehow by not promoting it.
So which would I rather be seen as? A shameless self promoter or a nefarious "hider" of my book? The latter most definitely argues against the former I would say. Nonetheless, I chose to not make the book an issue, (the facts DO speak for themselves after all). The link to the book's website has always ever been part of my signature, so I doubt I could credibly be accused of "hiding" my involvement in my own book.

There have been several posters who came here and posted info and a link to their books, or websites and they were not attacked. Most were welcomed by several of the regular posters as well as our Admin. Numenorean7

Yes, Titor's purported mission to 1975 has never been confirmed. The evidence that I discovered far overshadowed the quirks in the 5100 (only one of which you seem to be aware of), thus rendering the 5100 portion of the story just that, a portion.

Actually, Titor's first post at anomalies.net says;

Posted by John Titor on 01-27-2001 12:45 PM
Greetings. I am a time traveler from the year 2036. I am on my way home after getting an IBM 5100 computer system from the year 1975.

I see the believers constantly saying that Titor's predictions have come true, therefore he is a time traveler.
So many Titor enthusiasts make him out to be a prophet from obscure predictions that haven't occurred but the followers make events fit their fantasy.

Posted by John Titor on 02-08-2001 01:18 PM
I would characterize world politics as two boxers who have just gone multiple rounds and they’re both pretty beat up. I’m sure someone out there wants to kill us but no one is very organized yet. There is a great deal of fear over rogue groups coming across un-launched missile systems, 55 gallon drums of Anthrax or portable nuclear weapons.
((Korea United?))
I guess you could say that. Taiwan, Japan and Korea were all “forcefully annexed” before N Day.
I don’t remember a great deal about media coverage during the civil conflicts. I would probably characterize it the same way you see coverage of Waco, Ruby Ridge and Elian Gonzalez.
From my viewpoint, yes, this is an alternate timeline. From your viewpoint, no.
I have thought again about how to revel information that would make me more believable but I always come across the following problems:
1.All of you become much less interesting as sheep. I can’t talk to you if you’re not skeptical.
2.Anything I say could be acted on beforehand and changed anyway.
3.All the really interesting information is months or years away and I’d be gone when it happens.
4.I find it morally wrong to assist someone with anything where they might gain and someone else would lose or die.
5.There’s a slim chance your worldline is just different enough my “prediction” won’t happen.
6.I simply don’t know.
Consider that you are a time traveler who goes back in time to the first week of February 1970 and you are confronted with the same problem. What do you remember right now about the second week of February 1970? Naturally, the conflict in Vietnam and the Middle East come up but as someone has already stated here, “that’s old news”. I suppose I could predict the failure of Apollo 13 spacecraft but since time travel is ridiculous, I would be blamed for sabotage. I might even decide to tell you about an earthquake in Peru but then people that would have died by chance will now live and vice versa.
All I can think of is to make something up. So here goes…. The space shuttle mission may or may not have a problem connecting the new lab to the space station.
How was that?

On 02-08-2001 Titor is able to reference these past occurrences:
"The Waco siege" began on February 28, 1993, and ended on April 19
"Ruby Ridge" occured betweenAugust 21 to 31 1992
"Elian Gonzalez" was taken by Federal agents April 22, 2000. He was returned to Cuba June 28, 2000.
Then:

Posted by John Titor on 03-24-2001 06:19 PM
I will be leaving this worldline shortly and this will be my final post. There are only a handful of people who will know exactly when I will be leaving and I’m sure they will let you know when I’m gone.

Titor's final post. Less than 6 months before the Nations greatest tragedy since Pearl Harbor. He makes no reference to it even in the most oblique manner possible. He could have said only that a great catastrophe would occur soon. Two buildings will be destroyed. There would be no way of knowing what it might be or how to avoid it.
Ah yes, this is where the oh-so-convenient alternate time line comes in to play.
So, it is Titor's story that I believe is false. Your interpretation of it is just that...your Interpretation...nothing more.

Still not seeing any evidence for a hoax.

So, it is Titor's story that I believe is false. Your interpretation of it is just that...your Interpretation...nothing more.

And no, I require no "interpretation" of facts, they speak for themselves. I am merely presenting them for anyone with the curiosity enough to read them.

 

[temporal recon]

As I don't do any promotion for my little project, now that I know it's not frowned upon:

Feel free to purchase Conviction of a Time Traveler at Amazon in both soft cover as well as Kindle.
If you purchase Conviction of a Time Traveler at Conviction of a Time Traveler, I will personally sign your copy.
Also, be sure to visit my blog at Conviction of a Time Traveler
An app has been developed and is available for both iPhones and Androids. You can download it at iTunes. I keep people updated on the movie and documentary projects there via the app. Full disclosure, I have no financial interest in the app, but I provide content for it.
Speaking of the movie and documentary projects, I am very excited for both. The movie has a working title of TimeTravel Zero. I was honored to be asked to be the technical expert for the film and even contributed to parts of the script, there are Easter eggs in there for those who know the actual truth. If you know, you'll see them.
The documentary I am also very excited about. It is by a gentleman by the name Jay Cheel, a Canadian filmmaker. I was very impressed with his professional distance he maintained with the story; curious but neutral. His project will have some incredible interviews and I am looking very much forward to when he is done. Currently, I act as an interviewee and may act as a sort of narrator of sorts as well. I have no financial interest in this project, but can't wait for it to be done. It will likely come out in Canada first, but it will be on American television shortly thereafter.
Anyone is free to watch the trailers of both projects at Conviction of a Time Traveler. Also at the site, there are links to some of the interviews I was invited to participate in. I don't really do interviews anymore, they're fun, but I just don't have time. Maybe in the future once the movie and documentary get closer to being released though.

I am endeavoring to figure out a way where I can alert via the COATT app that there is a new blog post. If anyone out there wants a small (unpaid) project and help with this, please IM me.


Quoting Mr. Peregrini: "There have been several posters who came here and posted info and a link to their books, or websites and they were not attacked. Most were welcomed by several of the regular posters as well as our Admin. Numenorean7"


thanks Mr. Peregrini for telling me it would be ok to talk about my little book project and evil money making scheme. I was starting to feel guilty about "hiding it" from all the forum members.

 

[Ren]

As I don't do any promotion for my little project, now that I know it's not frowned upon:
thanks Mr. Peregrini for telling me it would be ok to talk about my little book project and evil money making scheme. I was starting to feel guilty about "hiding it" from all the forum members.

Don't hesitate. You and our Canadian filmmaker friend are getting the messages out. You deserve that money for all the hassle you're taking on behalf of John and his mission.

 

[Peregrini]

wow peregrini. you sure do assume alot on the very little bit of info you have on John.
especially assuming John knew nothing of 911 just because he didnt post about it.
I, for one am VERY happy he didnt post about it. You have very little information on what posting
about such an event would cause for other people or you just dont care.
John Titor posting was twelve years ago. You never knew John. You never spoke with him.
You never met anyone else on the team. You do not have info on any current info. you are simply
relying on information in posts from twelve years ago. Most of which served a purpose that doesnt even
involve you at all. I think John himself would probably get sick of reading the same regurgitated arguments over and over and over.
Nobody really gives a hoot if you believe John was a real time traveler or not.
No...I really have no interest in talking to you beyond this post. I hate to say this but the truth is John Titor just didnt end when
he stopped posting online. I just posted this because it simply AMAZES me that people think they are an expert on John and simply
dont know shit beyond his postings.

Each of us believes things that are not true.
Sigh.....

wow peregrini. you sure do assume alot on the very little bit of info you have on John.

First, I stated above I never assume.
as·sume [uh-soom] as·sumed, as·sum·ing.
verb (used with object)
1. to take for granted or without proof:
I look for proof. Regarding the Titor story, there is none.
Second, I have the same actual evidence that anyone else has (except you..see below). If there is newly discovered evidence, other than speculation and conjecture by all the "experts", it certainly hasn't been discussed anywhere on the internet that I know of and in my search for info about Titor I would have found something. If I missed something please link to it.
Third, it is you that has done a lot of assuming in this post:
I would list them but that would pretty much be the whole post.

especially assuming John knew nothing of 911 just because he didnt post about it.

I did not say Titor "knew" nothing about 9/11. I pointed out that he didn't say anything about it.

I, for one am VERY happy he didnt post about it. You have very little information on what posting
about such an event would cause for other people or you just dont care.

I fail to see how posting (predicting, prophesying, foretelling, foreseeing, or any other term you wish to insert) something obscure about any event would necessarily alter anyone's perception of the event. Psychics make predictions at the beginning of each year. Sometimes lightning strikes and they get one right (or close to right) yet I have never heard about anyone being adversely affected by those predictions.
But, since he didn't, we have no information so, we will never know.

John Titor posting was twelve years ago. You never knew John. You never spoke with him.
You never met anyone else on the team. You do not have info on any current info. you are simply
relying on information in posts from twelve years ago.

I concede you are in a unique position having had personal contact with Titor thru e-mails and whatever other means but, that doesn't make "what" you know "true". It is also my present understanding that you have had no contact with him since he left. That makes what you know 12 years old also.

Most of which served a purpose that doesnt even involve you at all.

Most of what he talked about was a Civil War and a Third World War. Just how do you judge that does not involve me?

I think John himself would probably get sick of reading the same regurgitated arguments over and over and over.

Unless he returns and tells us we won't know for sure. It is just as likely (perhaps more) that he is following the tempest he created and laughing his ass off.

Nobody really gives a hoot if you believe John was a real time traveler or not.

It would appear you do.

No...I really have no interest in talking to you beyond this post.

You didn't "have" to talk to me with "this" post.

I hate to say this but the truth is John Titor just didnt end when he stopped posting online.

That's the first thing I've seen that is actually correct. It is still being discussed here and other places.

I just posted this because it simply AMAZES me that people think they are an expert on John and simply
dont know shit beyond his postings.

Again, with the notable exception of you, NO ONE HAS ANY VALID INFO ON TITOR BEYOND HIS POSTINGS.
I have read his posts, as well as most of yours, I believe I do know "Shit".
So, if you made it this far or read this at all, let me close by saying;
With all due respect, I do not require your approval to debate the validity of Titor's story.

 

[temporal recon]

wow peregrini. you sure do assume alot on the very little bit of info you have on John.
especially assuming John knew nothing of 911 just because he didnt post about it.
I, for one am VERY happy he didnt post about it. You have very little information on what posting
about such an event would cause for other people or you just dont care.
John Titor posting was twelve years ago. You never knew John. You never spoke with him.
You never met anyone else on the team. You do not have info on any current info. you are simply
relying on information in posts from twelve years ago. Most of which served a purpose that doesnt even
involve you at all. I think John himself would probably get sick of reading the same regurgitated arguments over and over and over.
Nobody really gives a hoot if you believe John was a real time traveler or not.
No...I really have no interest in talking to you beyond this post. I hate to say this but the truth is John Titor just didnt end when
he stopped posting online. I just posted this because it simply AMAZES me that people think they are an expert on John and simply
dont know shit beyond his postings.

Each of us believes things that are not true.
Sigh.....

Very True.

wow peregrini. you sure do assume alot on the very little bit of info you have on John.

First, I stated above I never assume.

No, you didn't "say" you assumed anything. Nonetheless, you're making assumptions all over the place. In Conviction of a Time Traveler I present evidence; evidence that is specifically NOT interpretations of assumptions but actual, historical and verifiable facts. John made a mountain of predictions that were not necessarily presented as predictions. No, I'm not referring to the Civil War or Olympic predictions. These were predictions presented as such. The items I identify in the book are the first time many of them have been identified and researched. A large reason for this is because many of the things John spoke about in 2000 didn't exist yet. That is now no longer the case.

as·sume [uh-soom] as·sumed, as·sum·ing.
verb (used with object)
1. to take for granted or without proof:

Ole Webster sure gets a workout at your house, doesn't he? I wonder if anyone else reading these posts notices the irony?

I look for proof. Regarding the Titor story, there is none.

Is that an assumption I see, Mr. Peregrini? Assuming you have turned over every rock on the internet in search of the truth of Mr. Titor? My favorite quote seems oddly appropriate here again:
"Every man takes the limits of his own field of vision for the limits of the world."

Second, I have the same actual evidence that anyone else has (except you..see below).

Another pesky assumption. See my favorite quote above.

If there is newly discovered evidence, other than speculation and conjecture by all the "experts", it certainly hasn't been discussed anywhere on the internet that I know of

First you have to start asking the right questions, my friend. Once you know what to look for, it's not that difficult.

and in my search for info about Titor I would have found something.

Do I need to say it again?

If I missed something please link to it.

Conviction of a Time Traveler

I, for one am VERY happy he didnt post about it. You have very little information on what posting
about such an event would cause for other people or you just dont care.

I fail to see how posting (predicting, prophesying, foretelling, foreseeing, or any other term you wish to insert) something obscure about any event would necessarily alter anyone's perception of the event.

Your failure to perceive seems to be at the root of your lack of progress in the Titor question.

Psychics make predictions at the beginning of each year...

This, Mr. Peregrini is an outstanding point, but likely for a reason you did not intend.









This is for everyone reading this thread: John Titor was not a psychic. Many before us have attempted to judge the claims made by Mr. Titor against the backdrop of how one would judge a psychic. If they get the prediction wrong ("you will come into a great deal of money soon") and it does not happen, you may safely judge that the psychic was either a charlatan or simply not a good psychic. We can make this judgment because we approach the psychic from a common understanding that the psychic is endeavouring to provide accurate information. THIS IS NOT THE CASE FOR JOHN TITOR. John Titor was on a military mission and was under no requirement to tell us the truth about anything. The same problem can be recognized for anybody claiming to be a time traveler (if we allow the conceit that they are gov't sponsored). So the natural next question will be, "if we can't trust what a time traveler is saying as true, that his predictions could be purposefully false, how do we judge if they are real or not?"
This is a good and right question. There are ways to discern the true time travelers from the hoaxes. Qronos 1 and Qronos 16 are examples (along with Titor of course) of real time travelers. There are others.

John Titor posting was twelve years ago. You never knew John. You never spoke with him.
You never met anyone else on the team. You do not have info on any current info. you are simply
relying on information in posts from twelve years ago.

I concede you are in a unique position having had personal contact with Titor thru e-mails and whatever other means but, that doesn't make "what" you know "true". It is also my present understanding that you have had no contact with him since he left. That makes what you know 12 years old also.

Can anyone spot the assumption Mr. Peregrini is making in this portion of his post?

Most of what he talked about was a Civil War and a Third World War.

Nope. It would appear you missed quite a bit present in his posts. Did you notice the code?

I hate to say this but the truth is John Titor just didnt end when he stopped posting online.

That's the first thing I've seen that is actually correct. It is still being discussed here and other places.

While you are correct in observing that others continue to discuss the titor story (though none of its implications unfortunately), our friend Pam here is talking about the ongoing story of time travel and the team itself.

NO ONE HAS ANY VALID INFO ON TITOR BEYOND HIS POSTINGS.

My my, Mr. Peregrini. You are an assumption machine! Again, I will refer you to Conviction of a Time Traveler

I have read his posts, as well as most of yours, I believe I do know "Shit".

Not from the evidence I've seen. Which is ok, really. But I would dissuade you from calling your failure to make progress in the Titor story as "proof" (to use your terms) that no other evidence exists. This brings us back to
"Every man takes the limits of his own field of vision for the limits of the world."

 

[Peregrini]

thanks Mr. Peregrini for telling me it would be ok to talk about my little book project and evil money making scheme. I was starting to feel guilty about "hiding it" from all the forum members.

I didn't say it was OK or give you permission. I said others were not attacked. If you do want to advertise your book, speak with Numenorean7 and he may let you for a fee.

Still not seeing any evidence for a hoax.

And you probably never will. I have offered to compare "my truth" with "your truth" but you can only offer the same excuse:

Also, there is something to be said for working for your understanding. If I were to simply present my evidence on an online forum, it cheapens and lessens its impact and simply becomes another easily dismissed "theory." If you want to know the actual truth, you're gonna have to work for it.

Though I fail to understand how my credibility affects discovered facts. My discoveries as they relate to the Titor story are just that, discoveries of fact. My credibility (for better or worse) do not affect the immutability of these newly discovered facts.

Peregrini said: I know the actual truth, to the same extent that you do.

You continue to assert this. This is incorrect. I would recommend anyone interested in learning the current state of our understanding and the evidence that currently exists to allow for the fact that maybe there might be more information out there than we initially thought.

Facts need no interpretation, they speak for themselves, Mr Peregrini. In Conviction of a Time Traveler all I do is present the evidence that did not yet exist in 2000 and had lay undiscovered until then. I allow the reader to draw their own (unavoidable) conclusions. As a matter of fact, I make it quite clear that no contortions of logic are required. Plain speaking facts are all they are, though admittedly, some chapters did get a little technical, say the Optical Frequency Comb section.

Now that I know that Titor was a real time traveler (supported by evidence leading to only one conclusion), I have taken to preparing for the inevitable event that will fundamentally change this world. And, unfortunately, it will happen soon. The book's aim was to do one thing really, and one thing only: to present the actual evidence to people who are curious enough about what Titor claimed and combat the careless debunking done by others in the previous 12 years.

And no, I require no "interpretation" of facts, they speak for themselves. I am merely presenting them for anyone with the curiosity enough to read them.

As I've said before, to properly present the evidence, it must be done in an orderly fashion. Simply providing a list of all the facts as evidence here is insufficient. The reason this is so is because any individual fact can be explained away as mere coincidence or conspiracy. But when you put all the facts together (as a prosecuting attorney would for a jury) and present the entire body of evidence as a whole, the conclusion is unavoidable.
If I were to, as you put it, present just a "snippet," that snippet would be attacked individually. Intellectually dishonest debunkers could easily call it coincidence and need no evidence to support this claim. Likewise, any piece of evidence could be attacked individually by an equally invented argument against its existence, again with no requirement for evidence on behalf of the debunker. I have seen this happen too often in the last 12 years to allow it to happen again. The subject matter is much too important to allow a debunker to dismiss Titor's statements so carelessly.

If not one single piece of your evidence can stand on it's own but can only be effective when presented all together, you have nothing but circumstantial evidence.
You'll have little chance of prevailing in court'

Peregrini said: So, it is Titor's story that I believe is false. Your interpretation of it is just that...your Interpretation...nothing more.

In Conviction of a Time Traveler, I state quite clearly that I am not providing "proof." I can only provide evidence. As I said before, there is a difference between the two. And, to take your opening statement to its correct and proper conclusion, evidence comes from actual facts, not the other way around as you assert.

We began this discussion with reference to your evidence which you have alternately referred to as facts and evidence. Evidence and proof are actually more synonymous. Facts are derived from them. Quite simply neither facts nor evidence can speak for themselves. They are presented and are considered for their factuality.
You don't appear to have taken any classes on logic or science because there you would have learned that what you may see as facts are not. True facts are the result of testing and interpretation of the results. There is no way for you to have tested the evidence that was left by Titor. He was actually quite careful at first by refusing to give predictions for various (moral?) reasons but he let the excitement of the moment get the better of him and made a few after all. He cleverly covered his ass with the multiple time line pretext and divergence. If you understood logic at all you would know you have this backwards. If you want to understand that, you will have to work for it...look it up.

I wonder, when people who normally might have taken Titor's claims as real and actually prepared for what's about to happen, yet they find themselves convinced by debunkers (such as yourself Mr. Peregrini) that what Titor said was bogus so they decided to do nothing in preparation, will you and others like you feel any guilt for their suffering?

WHAT? You think Titor was THE FIRST to predict doom and gloom.

If I knew the truth (as I understood it at the time), how could I not tell the world that 12 years of debunking by intellectually dishonest people was untrue?
The rest of your post is merely attacking the messenger, so I won't bother responding to it.

I haven't called you any names or accused you of being intellectually dishonest ( and considering this discussion...) so, Who is attacking the messenger?

Your Honor;
temporal recon has failed to present any evidence, proof, or facts. He has only offered evasion tactics. He has failed to prove his case.
The Plaintiff rests.

 

[Peregrini]

And now you feel qualified to speak for PamelaM?