Philosophical descrepancies in JT story

justoneme

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Philosophical descrepancies in JT story

Originally posted by pauli@Aug 10 2004, 01:32 AM
...

John Titor talks about a Civil War brought on by gov't intrusion into the lives of people through a series of Waco type events. Pre 9/11 such a concept was not unthinkable, since we only had examples of Waco, Ruby Ridge & the Elian Gonzales stand-off....


He clearly said it was the gov't against the people, not the Dems against the Repubs.

I guess what I am working toward here is, \"Who besides me thinks the JT material fits more into the world of Sept. 10th 2001 than the current world in which we now live?\"



I agree with JT on this, and pre 9/11 we had Oklahoma City, in which MANY questions still remain. After OKC militias were routed out, infiltrated and placed on the list of terrorists. Today, and in the near future we'll see problems coming from RFID, electronic voting, black boxes in cars, and other devious attempts to control every moment of Americans lives. All it would take is a couple people with guns. For instance, here in Cleveland Ohio we had a nut with a gun at case western university a while back, had he brought some friends, it could have easily developed into another standoff situation. There were at least 4 other standoffs in the local news here in the last year. Any one of these had the potential to be another Waco, thank God they didn't.

The gov't is clearly against the people, all one needs to see to recognize that is a family tree such as this one http://msn.ancestry.com/landing/strange/bush4/tree.htm or this one http://www.familyforest.com/Kerry_Bush_Cousins.html The democrats and republicans are clearly the left and right hand of whoever is manipulating us. They are equally corrupt, the only difference is how much KY jelly you'll need to deal with them. How about looking at any of the pictures from the DNC showing the free speech zone, wait until the end of the month, you'll see more of the same... they're clearly afraid of us.

After finding and reading through JT's stuff, I think he was either legit or had some high sources in the gov't, just like Chris Carter.

The thing that bothers me about all of this, potential prophesies, conspiracy theories, and the like is that the vast majority of people automatically assume you to be insane, they tune you out like someone handing out religious literature on the street, without even hearing or looking at the overwhelming evidence.

OK, that's enough for now, back to trying to take it all in.

Tom
 

Coincidencereality

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Philosophical descrepancies in JT story

I think I understand now. He saw waco like events but wouldnt say exactly what kinda events since he talks in riddles and wants us to figure them out. He wouldnt even say who the enemy was when asked. All he would reply was the enemy is the people who arrests others or something weird. MAYBE the waco events he replies to are like whats going on in Iraq right now and other countries people against america by causing terrorism, demonstrations, i think he even said our current gov is one of the enemies. Maybe this terrorism will turn worse by other countires getting more pissed off at us like china and russia and this time were confronted by someone like that instead of these lil terrorist. TRY this on, Other countries see how easily americas economy can colapse since 9-11, a country that wants to bring america down will not do it in the traditional way such as launching a warhead to us. No they will have some guys bring it over and set it in key cities with a timer along with nukes and bio weopans, even a small country like iran can do this with barely any money, america loses 7 cities and has no idea to strike back against.
 

Coincidencereality

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Philosophical descrepancies in JT story

The guy said mad cow would happen and it did. But the guy used an old vehicle a corvette. When he should be using a newer car maybe one from 2015 or something. But this guy went far into creating those details all the way down to the shot gun holder. But its kinda funny he makes it out like his car a a delorean lOL like from back to the future. while steve the other guy who claims to tt uses the sliders approach. So shoot your stuck in the middle not knowing what to think.
 

Lonewolf

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Philosophical descrepancies in JT story

Ok, call me naiev and all, but I am not ready to see our gov't as being that bad. It is possible, I know that, but I am not yet that cynical. I would have to see more evidence to support it first.

Evidence #1 - Read the Fema report on why the WTC collapse happened. Then explain buiding # 7 to me.
Evidence # 2 - Read the NORAD Standard Ops procedure handbook, and explain to me how a plane hijacked directly after the towers had been struck could make it to the pentagon.

Our country may have taken a wrong turn somewhere, but as to it being this?? Again, I am not this cynical yet. In the overall picture, we have a clash of ideas in the Western world today and in the end one of the philosophies will come out on top.

I agree with you on this. But remember, John said that the enemy would eventually not be the American people, but the American Governement. I think of lot of the information exposed currently supports that.

As to the Patriot Act, I am in a \"wait and see\" mode. I agree it could be misused, however, we have had Presidents in the past restrict Civil Liberties and when the situation was over, they reinstated them without a problem. There is precedent for differences between war time rules and peace time rules. If, however, I start seeing the sorts of gross abuses mentioned by Titor... I will not keep my eyes or my mouth closed.

As in the case of Jose Padilla, or are you unaware that right now a U.S. citizen is being held without charges or a planned trial?

Ah yes, the polarization issue. (btw I am not saying that in a condescending or dismissive way.) I also see the polarization in our society. Whether we like it or not, there are two different value systems at work in the US right now. In fact those systems came into being in the 1960's and have continued to this day. There are those who adhere to a more, or less, socialistic sort of frame of reference, and those who do not. The divide runs down a philosophical, religious and political basis. The article listed above covers that. It is truly a wound which has not healed. It also, to my mind, has a spiritual basis. I can tell you on the other side there is a real fear about those whose patriotism includes the UN. We are not too happy about a US gov't that seeks to bring the UN, a governing body which is doubtful at best into American politics. (for instance, note how their \"peacekeepers\" are the first to run when the bullets begin to fly. I have heard them called the \"United Nothing\" by people in the ME.) So, yes, you are correct there is a polarization.
The polarization is not so definable in my belief. But I do see how John's characterization of our lifetims as "lazy, self centered, civilly ignorant sheep" could be accurate, since my office could only correctly pick 6 ammendments from the constitution, and all of them could tell me the American Idol winner. Sad times indeed.


As for prophecies, I have been a boy scout, so the phrase "be prepared" is always a must. Even if things aren't expected, you can prepare for them.
 

Lonewolf

Junior Member
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34
Philosophical descrepancies in JT story

Originally posted by Coincidencereality@Aug 11 2004, 02:01 AM
I think I understand now. He saw waco like events but wouldnt say exactly what kinda events since he talks in riddles and wants us to figure them out. He wouldnt even say who the enemy was when asked. All he would reply was the enemy is the people who arrests others or something weird. MAYBE the waco events he replies to are like whats going on in Iraq right now and other countries people against america by causing terrorism, demonstrations, i think he even said our current gov is one of the enemies. Maybe this terrorism will turn worse by other countires getting more pissed off at us like china and russia and this time were confronted by someone like that instead of these lil terrorist. TRY this on, Other countries see how easily americas economy can colapse since 9-11, a country that wants to bring america down will not do it in the traditional way such as launching a warhead to us. No they will have some guys bring it over and set it in key cities with a timer along with nukes and bio weopans, even a small country like iran can do this with barely any money, america loses 7 cities and has no idea to strike back against.

Circumventing the constitution by the government is BAD. Jose Padilla may be the first of many U.S. citizens who are held without charges, or trial, thus violating the fourth ammendment of the constitution. The government tells people that this is for their safety, and most people believe that the government is keeping them safer from terrorism right now.
The chain of events leading to world war three, as John described, is that America's involvement with the conflict between the Arabs and the Jews. Once American's can no longer support "peacekeeping" efforts, the striking there will begin and it's the domino effect of WW2. I mean, look at history, how could a Archibishop getting shot lead to a world war?
And here's a final twist for you. What if you find out that the government has been lying to you? That we have killed over one million people in the past two years for no reason that we were told. Did Iraq have any WMD? In the two years of occupying an area the size of Georgia, 0 have been found. As for an ability to attack the U.S. or links to Al-queda, none have been made. So, really, is it hard to believe that the government is dishonest to you, the average citizen?
 

Lonewolf

Junior Member
Messages
34
Philosophical descrepancies in JT story

Originally posted by Deebokonon@Aug 10 2004, 04:38 AM
Also I can only weep for the people of this country who believe that John Kerry is an answer to GB and the NWO crowd. It is sad that the voters cannot see that both candidates are members of the same evil club.

Well, GB really does want global domination, and has pursued it in a manner very befitting Hitler. Anyone know what's going on at Gitmo these days? How about the other detention facilities? Is Aru Graib (*sp, sorry) really an aboration, or is it the only place that evidence of U.S. torture techniques was recorded.
 

Deebokonon

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Philosophical descrepancies in JT story

Hi Pauli,

There is much that I will want to post on the John Titor answers. So I wonder if this is the correct subject area for discussions on the birthplace of 2001 terrorism paranoia in America.

I will enthusiastically pursue this thread about that dire day. However, perhaps we should take this dialogue to a new subject area that will not detract from the things we may share about John Titor?s Q/A posts.

I am the author of a new physics known as Sequential Physics and also a book on the Time Derivative. Twenty years of presenting radical material from the university level to those of discussion group threads have given me an edge on skeptical examinations.

Its nice to be very level headed but know that each of the techniques of dialogue can be used decisively.

It?s like my brother would say in a very level headed and serious tone. ?I only swear when I need effect.? And then, very emphatically he would add, ?And damn it, right now I need effect!?

Where in the time travel forum can we go with this? Got any ideas?

Deebokonon
 

Deebokonon

New Member
Messages
3
Philosophical descrepancies in JT story

Hi Pauli,

There is much that I will want to post on the John Titor answers. So I wonder if this is the correct subject area for discussions on the birthplace of 2001 terrorism paranoia in America.

I will enthusiastically pursue this thread about that dire day. However, perhaps we should take this dialogue to a new subject area that will not detract from the things we may share about John Titor?s Q/A posts.

I am the author of a new physics known as Sequential Physics and also a book on the Time Derivative. Twenty years of presenting radical material from the university level to those of discussion group threads have given me an edge on skeptical examinations.

Its nice to be very level headed but know that each of the techniques of dialogue can be used decisively.

It?s like my brother would say in a very level headed and serious tone. ?I only swear when I need effect.? And then, very emphatically he would add, ?And damn it, right now I need effect!?

Where in the time travel forum can we go with this? Got any ideas?

Deebokonon
 

keylempa

New Member
Messages
12
Philosophical descrepancies in JT story

Originally posted by Lonewolf@Aug 11 2004, 07:51 AM
Evidence #1 - Read the Fema report on why the WTC collapse happened. Then explain buiding # 7 to me.
Evidence # 2 - Read the NORAD Standard Ops procedure handbook, and explain to me how a plane hijacked directly after the towers had been struck could make it to the pentagon.

lonewolf, is there any chance you can link us to these documents? I, for one, would be very interested.
 

keylempa

New Member
Messages
12
Philosophical descrepancies in JT story

Originally posted by Lonewolf@Aug 11 2004, 07:51 AM
Evidence #1 - Read the Fema report on why the WTC collapse happened. Then explain buiding # 7 to me.
Evidence # 2 - Read the NORAD Standard Ops procedure handbook, and explain to me how a plane hijacked directly after the towers had been struck could make it to the pentagon.

lonewolf, is there any chance you can link us to these documents? I, for one, would be very interested.
 

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