Debate What is fourth dimension?

TimeFlipper

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obviously the vacuum that photons travel is space. So the aetheric medium and spacetime are intimately linked.

relativity being what it is..loses credibility not in it's factual relationships between mass-energy and spacetime but within the 1st principles of all of those.

Obviously photons aren't particles and waves same time. Only one at a time unless you believe particles are sentient and can predict being observed before they are. Anyways all that jazz is just fudges to cover up the aether's existence.

Kinda nice, cuz that means photons do have mass cuz the aether would.

I dont believe you need any "mediums" such as an aetheric and/or spacetime field...EM waves have an electrical and a magnetic vector, and because of those they will have an electric and magnetic field...In the presence of an electrical and magnetic field vector which "vibrates" perpendicular to each other, we get a perturbation or movement of the EM waves within a Vacuum, which is how they travel large distances.

You will be aware of the "Radio Stars" that send transmissions from many light years away from us...The way they do this is that their signals match the resonant frequency of the Hydrogen atoms (1420Mhz) which exist within the whole vacuum of Outer Space...The Hydrogen atoms act as a sort of "Cell Net" for getting those Radio Stars transmissions to us, again without any need of any other medium..
 
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NaturalPhilosopher

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2,299
but where do the EM fields come from?
In normal life, there's no such thing as EM fields emanated from nothing, not connected to a mass charge.

Perhaps the aether has charge as well and that is what is perturbed?

'virtual state' pair production that surrounds any isolated charged particle sure suggests so.
 

Mayhem

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Zenith
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The 3 dimensions, its all about perception.

The physical describes it as height weight and length as way to measure.

But there are things not visible in the 3rd dimension.

Though some of them can be measured, the four.

When you cant see its always said it cant be true. :)

Many cant see a human aura so those that can are in the 3rd dimension.?
 

TimeFlipper

Senior Member
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13,705
The 3 dimensions, its all about perception.

The physical describes it as height weight and length as way to measure.

But there are things not visible in the 3rd dimension.

Though some of them can be measured, the four.

When you cant see its always said it cant be true. :)

Many cant see a human aura so those that can are in the 3rd dimension.?

You have the beginnings of a good "philosopher", keep it up (y) :D..
 

TimeFlipper

Senior Member
Messages
13,705
but where do the EM fields come from?
In normal life, there's no such thing as EM fields emanated from nothing, not connected to a mass charge.

Perhaps the aether has charge as well and that is what is perturbed?

'virtual state' pair production that surrounds any isolated charged particle sure suggests so.

Hmm virtual pair production, so are you talking about a virtual "Cooper Pair" of virtual electrons? :cool::D
 

NaturalPhilosopher

Senior Member
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2,299
Pair production usually refers an electron and positron.

Infinite numbers of them surround any charged particle. They appear from 'nothing', rush to annihilate but in this case they don't produce a gamma ray. That's why they're called 'virtual' cuz they violate conservation of energy. If they were accepted as real then would cause a crisis of physics.

This is well known in particle physics labs but electrical engineering departments ignore it. This is the idea that a source charge(electric field aka dipole) causes broken symmetry of the vacuum. Lee and Yang discovered it in the 50's and was awarded a nobel prize.

The dirac sea is considered the probability that a gamma ray will produce a pair production(electron and positron) anywhere in the universe. However, do the pair particles exist before the gamma ray 'materialize' them? Are they there everywhere but in an unobservable state? Is the dirac sea a real sea? How exactly does a gamma ray turn into an electron and positron? Nobody knows.

So instead of scientists saying 'ok, they're real pairs' but have a strange thing that prevents production of a gamma ray when annihiliating they just say they're not real at all. Bit of a fudge to save conservation of energy.

Is that the aether?

 
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TimeFlipper

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13,705
Hmm interesting stuff you bring up....When the annihilation event of an electron and positron pair occur a neutral pion is formed which rapidly decays into Gamma rays...The term virtual electron and positron mean neither of them actually exist in reality, and can therefore be created out of "nothing"..
So if you need an amount of energy you can "borrow" it from an energy bank, for a very short period of time given by the Heisenberg Uncertainty principle of a time/energy version, which has to be "paid back quickly"...:)

Therefore a Virtual electron-positron pair is one that is created from nothing in this way, and then goes back into vacuum as the pair annihilates...That Virtual electron-positron pairing was only created to solve a problem..

Lee and Yang apparently were awarded the Nobel Prize in 1957 for discovering that "parity", a property that physicists believed was always conserved, such as energy..momentum..and electric charge, actually need NOT be conserved.. :oops:

The Dirac Sea was seen as an area in which there were lots of negative electrons stopping any positive electrons (positrons), getting through...However the idea of holes in the "Sea" did allow positrons through and there were times when the electron-positron pairing was created and the annihilation of them resulted (as above) in the neutral pion forming and producing the Gamma waves, not the other way round.....Could the Dirac Sea actually be the Aether?? Your guess is just as good as mine (y)..

And thanks for the research i had to do to try and answer your questions, i enjoyed doing that immensely :D..
 

NaturalPhilosopher

Senior Member
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2,299
4th dimension is charge, spin and mass.
as a spatial vector it's parallel to EM field lines and spin.

remember Einstein said that mass isn't inside spacetime but rather 'extended into it'. That's why physicists claim electrons are point particles(dimensionless, as in no width, length or depth). As a 0 dimensional particle then their energy would have to be infinite. Another little issue for conservation.

Self contradictory riddles all throughout science.
 
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NaturalPhilosopher

Senior Member
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2,299
everyone assumes that virtual particles aren't real due to the creativity of scientists to come up with the conservation symmetry numbers so their equations would work.

However a leap in detecting real virtual pairs was made with Bedini's backpopper battery charging circuit. He found that when he would charge his battery using his high gradient battery charger it would work fine.

Now here's the rub, when he would charge it halfway then hook to a normal battery charger it would still pull current like it was uncharged. The voltage on the battery didn't go up while pulling a current. Then it would rise like normal still pulling a current starting many days later(it produces hydrogen gas but that can be quantified).

Where did the energy go? Talking thousands of joules.

aaaaaannnndddd-its-gone.jpg


Just like virtual pairs.
 
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