Earth Battery Experiment

thenumbersix

Member
Messages
290
Re: Earth Battery Experiment

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(\"Timebender\")</div>
Six,
I'm impressed by Shanes idea of doing parallel experiments. If you're of a mind to, we could design a few experiments between us and I'll get back to the earth battery business. Let me know if you're interested and we can post all our results here.
TB
PS, Thanks for the idea Shane![/b]

TB, Definitely interested, where shall we start ?
 

thenumbersix

Member
Messages
290
Re: Earth Battery Experiment

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(\"Timebender\")</div>
If you have seen Stubblefields patent, keep in mind that that it is not merely a simple galvanic configuration, but it's very structure lends one to wonder of the transformer properties of the coiled wires. This very type of \"battery\" is what Stubblefield used to light carbon arc lamps which require a large amount of current. The nine amps thyat I was pulling may have been adequate for small diameter electrodes though I never tried it.
[/b]

TB, That patent is weird, have you had any success with it ? He says that simply dampening the inner coil will produce the final voltage yet the iron and copper coils are insulated from each other ?? He talks of electrolytes but is this possible with the insulation. He is saying to use some cloth as insulation so is it truly insulated, maybe not..

I would be fascinated if any voltage came out of the inner core of this thing with proper insulation.. Have seen some really old motors with cloth insulation before. Theoretically no more than 2v should come from the inner coil...If it were fully insulated and producing electricity then we'd be onto some sort of galvanic corrosion meets quantum tunneling :D I think I might try using cloth first....

He has basically created an electromagnet using a battery and tapped electricity from an induction coil around the body of the whole thing...

The only benefits I could see are where he hints at using the Earth as an electrolyte and this is where his device is tapping into natural fields to boost the magnetic field for final output, seems like the only way he could get a substantial voltage from it.
 

thenumbersix

Member
Messages
290
Re: Earth Battery Experiment

Have recently put some large steel posts into the garden to support a hammock. One is about 2 1/2 metres from the battery.. Obviously I got the voltmeter out to see what we would have there.

The weird thing is across the new steel pole and the existing copper pipe in the battery I got 0.85v, this is across a gap of 2 1/2 metres and was there straight away (is 0.5v less than the battery - is this because of the extra distance or consistency of the metal possibly). This leads me to think that the galvanic corrosion is working at an atomic level and is instantaneous, am going to research this a bit more.

I also hammered in the left over copper pipe at the same point as the new pole and got some milivolts across this and the other copper pipe from the battery. I can't decide if this is evidence for geomantic current or just galvanic corrosion, just to a lesser extent. Same metals will still create this effect, though they were originally the same pipe before I cut them apart with a hacksaw...One is longer than the other by a fair amount.

Have yet to check voltages across other poles. Am currently in France for the weekend visiting the outlaws
biggrin.gif
The two posts for the hammock are fairly large and go quite deep, am hoping for some results from these, though a good method of discounting galvanic corrosion would be useful....Obviously the best way would be to get more than 2v, am going to have a play with some long wire and two posts if i get time this week. I managed to get tickets for Glastonbury Festival, will be sure to keep my eye out for some 'Earth Energy' types while there...
 

Timebender

Junior Member
Messages
37
Re: Earth Battery Experiment

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(\"thenumbersix\")</div>
TB, That patent is weird, have you had any success with it ? He says that simply dampening the inner coil will produce the final voltage yet the iron and copper coils are insulated from each other ?? He talks of electrolytes but is this possible with the insulation. He is saying to use some cloth as insulation so is it truly insulated, maybe not..
I agree. ?In Stubblefield's era the typical arrangement for insulating wire was a cotton sleeve. ?If you can dig up some old motor winding manuals, etc. you will see the wire gauge listed with a designation of \"CC\" meaning cotton covered or \"DCC\" meaning double cotton covered. ?Certainly not an insulation as we know it but one that certainly explains the wetting of the inner coil. ?He simply caused a galvanic reaction between the wires. ?
I would be fascinated if any voltage came out of the inner core of this thing with proper insulation.. Have seen some really old motors with cloth insulation before. Theoretically no more than 2v should come from the inner coil...If it were fully insulated and producing electricity then we'd be onto some sort of galvanic corrosion meets quantum tunneling :D I think I might try using cloth first....

He has basically created an electromagnet using a battery and tapped electricity from an induction coil around the body of the whole thing... ?

The only benefits I could see are where he hints at using the Earth as an electrolyte and this is where his device is tapping into natural fields to boost the magnetic field for final output, seems like the only way he could get a substantial voltage from it.[/b]
Herein lies the issues which I could not explain via conventional physics/electronics theory. There is definitely a mis understood property in these experiments as you have surmised.
 

Bernard

Junior Member
Messages
32
Re: Earth Battery Experiment

Hi there,

I would be interested in how you set up your earth battery and what sort of voltages and currents you obtain. Plus any additional information such as sites etc.,

I am certainly thinking of setting up an earth battery in the near future.

Bernard
 

thenumbersix

Member
Messages
290
Re: Earth Battery Experiment

Doing a search on Stubblefield and carbon lamps I came up with this :

Stubblefield

TB.

More results to come soon, have finally caught up with my work and managed to survive the floods of Glastonbury (saw a free energy place almost every night but was shut and then could never locate it again in the day, wasn't meant to be I guess...) and now have a bit more time on my hands. I reckon I could knock up one of those Stubblefields' coil assemblies.

Am thinking two would be better to try and create a potential between the them, an interesting point in that link about the height difference, I have the perfect hill in mind to try it out with.

Am bored with measuring the volts on my two pipes, time to move onto the bigger and betterer ;)


Bernard

Welcome, have a good read through the thread, there may be other points in a similar thread of TimeBenders', is linked in the first post. Everything you need is here or linked to, have a go yourself, it is well worth the effort of bashing two bits of pipe into the ground :D

My next plan is to set up a series of the junk pipe cells to get enough volts to power a 3v LED, I want to get a measurement of current from it. Made a 4v battery out of a small potato cut in 4 and some screws n wires, has been dimly lighting an LED for two days now. I couldn't get a readable current from it, presuming I am doing it right which I'm pretty sure I am. My neighbour grows them, in case you were wondering, and I was bored watching him dig...

Am getting a steady 0.9v from the two bits of pipe so I'm hoping that 4 cells will be enough to light the LED. It came out of a Solar Charged Garden Light which I bought a the local garage, will also experiment with charging the batteries from the Earth Battery instead of solar and see how long it lasts....

More info :

Someone trying, by the looks of it, the Stubblefield Cell

Some good reading here (search through the text for arc lamps)

Stubblefield Meanderings

In fact this Google Search turns up loads of references to the ability of the power for his lamps on his farm. There's some mention of them always being hung from old / large trees and the power being drawn off near the root...Hills and trees are going to be my next target...


Just one question : How does a carbon arc lamp compare with an LED on a physical level, it seems to me that an LED is creating an ARC also ?
 

virtualgirl

Member
Messages
255
Re: Earth Battery Experiment

Numbersix,

You made a battery out of a potato? I've never heard of that. Tell me how that works and remember, I am a layman. Tell it elementary style. You are so smart!! :)

Virtualgirl
 

Harte

Senior Member
Messages
4,562
Re: Earth Battery Experiment

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(\"virtualgirl\")</div>
Numbersix,

You made a battery out of a potato? I've never heard of that. Tell me how that works and remember, I am a layman. Tell it elementary style. You are so smart!! :)

Virtualgirl[/b]

VG,
Here's the complicated version for you, in case you decide to get some advanced degrees:
Get a potato
Stick a wire in one end of the potato
Stick a wire in the other end of the potato
Use a meter (or a small light bulb - {christmas light?}) to see the current!

This will also work with electrolytic solutions other than potato juice (lemons, oranges, apples)

Harte

Harte
 

thenumbersix

Member
Messages
290
Re: Earth Battery Experiment

Flattery will get you everywhere :D

It is basically the same as 4 AA batteries, each battery has an acidic liquid, ie the battery acid or the potato inside the skin, this is wet and quite acidic when fresh and is referrred to as the electrolyte.

Stuck in the electrolyte or potato will be two bits of metal, usually copper and zinc, which is why we get zinc whatever batteries. These are the anode and cathode (+ and - of the battery)

As you connect a wire to each bit of metal sticking out of the acid it creates the current by a chemical reaction between the two metals with in the acid.

Particles from one metal 'want' to move to coat the other, this is a natural process that occurs in this situation.

(The key is the difference in the metals, the further apart they are in a Noble table, below, the better it will work. NB. Same metals will also work a tiny amount as one will always be more prone to galvanic corrosion than the other, you will only get tiny voltages though.)

The result is electricity between the two exposed bits of metal :

batteryCell.jpg


The potato I cut in 4 and put a screw in each, then took 3 bits of wire and wrapped one end of each around the screws (Galvanised - Zinc Coated). The other end I pushed into the potato using a 1p coin (copper). So I have 4 bits of potato connected screw to coin then screw to coin then screw to coin, and at each end of the circuit i have one screw, on the first potato, and one coin, on the last potato, these have no wire on them, these are the + and - terminals of the battery.

Each potato piece is a cell of the overall battery. The picture above is one cell. Each cell can only create up to about 2v max. This is inherent in the physics of the process, doesn't matter how big you make it. This is why an AA 'battery' is only 1.5v, it is a single cell. As you put 4 of them into your remote control it joins them in series and makes 6v. This is what I have done with the wires, connected them in series (ie. + to - then again + to - and so on).

Because the potato is a weaker acid, the voltage isn't so high, I managed 3v, just enough to dimly light an LED, with an un-measurably small current (Amps). The strength of the acid, the distance the metals are apart on the Noble table and the size of the metals all determine different strengths of electrical power, ie. voltage, current, and life of battery.

An almost identical experiment : Potato Battery

potato.jpg


Hope that helps explain it a bit ?


NOBLE TABLE :

Active (Anodic)



  1. Magnesium
  2. Mg alloy AZ-31B
  3. Mg alloy HK-31A
  4. Zinc (hot-dip, die cast, or plated)
  5. Beryllium (hot pressed)
  6. Al 7072 clad on 7075
  7. Al 2014-T3
  8. Al 1160-H14
  9. Al 7079-T6
  10. Cadmium (plated)
  11. Uranium
  12. Al 218 (die cast)
  13. Al 5052-0
  14. Al 5052-H12
  15. Al 5456-0, H353
  16. Al 5052-H32
  17. Al 1100-0
  18. Al 3003-H25
  19. Al 6061-T6
  20. Al A360 (die cast)
  21. Al 7075-T6
  22. Al 6061-0
  23. Indium
  24. Al 2014-0
  25. Al 2024-T4
  26. Al 5052-H16
  27. Tin (plated)
  28. Stainless steel 430 (active)
  29. Lead
  30. Steel 1010
  31. Iron (cast)
  32. Stainless steel 410 (active)
  33. Copper (plated, cast, or wrought)
  34. Nickel (plated)
  35. Chromium (Plated)
  36. Tantalum
  37. AM350 (active)
  38. Stainless steel 310 (active)
  39. Stainless steel 301 (active)
  40. Stainless steel 304 (active)
  41. Stainless steel 430 (active)
  42. Stainless steel 410 (active)
  43. Stainless steel 17-7PH (active)
  44. Tungsten
  45. Niobium (columbium) 1% Zr
  46. Brass, Yellow, 268
  47. Uranium 8% Mo.
  48. Brass, Naval, 464
  49. Yellow Brass
  50. Muntz Metal 280
  51. Brass (plated)
  52. Nickel-silver (18% Ni)
  53. Stainless steel 316L (active)
  54. Bronze 220
  55. Copper 110
  56. Red Brass
  57. Stainless steel 347 (active)
  58. Molybdenum, Commercial pure
  59. Copper-nickel 715
  60. Admiralty brass
  61. Stainless steel 202 (active)
  62. Bronze, Phosphor 534 (B-1)
  63. Monel 400
  64. Stainless steel 201 (active)
  65. Carpenter 20 (active)
  66. Stainless steel 321 (active)
  67. Stainless steel 316 (active)
  68. Stainless steel 309 (active)
  69. Stainless steel 17-7PH (passive)
  70. Silicone Bronze 655
  71. Stainless steel 304 (passive)
  72. Stainless steel 301 (passive)
  73. Stainless steel 321 (passive)
  74. Stainless steel 201 (passive)
  75. Stainless steel 286 (passive)
  76. Stainless steel 316L (passive)
  77. AM355 (active)
  78. Stainless steel 202 (passive)
  79. Carpenter 20 (passive)
  80. AM355 (passive)
  81. A286 (passive)
  82. Titanium 5A1, 2.5 Sn
  83. Titanium 13V, 11Cr, 3Al (annealed)
  84. Titanium 6Al, 4V (solution treated and aged)
  85. Titanium 6Al, 4V (anneal)
  86. Titanium 8Mn
  87. Titanium 13V, 11Cr 3Al (solution heat treated and aged)
  88. Titanium 75A
  89. AM350 (passive)
  90. Silver
  91. Gold
  92. Graphite
End - Noble (Less Active, Cathodic)
 

Bernard

Junior Member
Messages
32
Re: Earth Battery Experiment

Hi numbersix,


I like the association with the Prisoner. It is truer than you think!

Since my post asking details I have searched the web quite a bit and it is amazing what you can turn up in a couple of days!

First in my searches is that the Americans used earth batteries for the telegraph. Leading on from that there is the postulation that earth cells could possibly short out due to ground conditions not giving the voltage you expect.

It was also noticed that there was a potential difference...(voltage difference) between different telegraph stations and that this could be used.....they called these differences telluric currents.

There was no indication of what voltage or currents that were obtained.

Second is that I have read or heard of Nikola Telsa, the person who virtually single handedly invented the power generation and supply system that we now use.....from what I have read he was a genius born before his time and it is only now that people are looking into his more abstract ideas.

This is a possibility of where the earth battery stems from. He had the idea of using the earth as one part of the conductor to transmit electrical power from one place to another...the other being not quite radio frequency waves...as he called it non Hertzian waves. From what I have read it certainly seems to be practical proposition.

He used a Telsa coil to make an electric current resonate in the earth...in the 1900 hundreds....he was laughed at for this idea but it has now being proved that he is correct about the earth resonating at certain frequencies.....hence possibly part of the idea of an earth battery. I feel that this may be part of the reason for some articles I have read for really high voltages to be produced. Again it is only by experimantation and observation that this will be proved to be so.

That is nothing though, he invented a Turbine of simple construction that is , he claims to be about 95 percent efficient. The possibilities with this device are quite astounding if you combine virtual wireless transmission of power. When they were developing engines for aeroplane. His turbine was at least five times lighter than the engines then invented. I feel there are some flaws here but it has been proved by another professor who investigated his turbine that it was theoretically possible to get around 95 percent efficency out of it. I can see the pump achieving this efficency mentally but as for reversing the process and making an equally efficient motor out of it seems to go against what I know of physics even if laminar flow can work in reverse with this device.

Like you I am interested in becoming grid free and with fuel prices going the way they are ...let alone the tax ....looking for other ways of motive power.....hence the interest in this turbine.

The dream or the impossibility as conventional science would have it is that of something for nothing. Like your earth batteries. This is where the fertile ground lays......some call it zero point energy the older generation call this source the ether. At least where this energy comes from

It has been scientifically proven that particles appear in a vacumn and disappear again. I am not sure whether this is connected or not but there are over unity devices out there that can be built.

Over unity meaning that you get more power out than you put it. What I read tonight knocked my socks off! Obviously it needs developing and I have read much in the same vain. It is possible to change the magnetic field at a point in space using a bar magnet and a coil on a former so that you can get 1.37 of the field...greater than unity. If this is so then it would or should be possible to get more power out than you put in. I have not thought this through but either you could make a supper efficient motor to generaty electricity or you could build a motorless generator.

This is what I have read and it would need me to build circuits that I do not have the space to do yet but this is an experiment carried out in the lab.....they do not break the laws of physics as described in these articles.....they utilize everyday physical laws.

The most promising of what I have found tonight is the easiest and most stunning phenonimum that Michael Farady noted but I believe is not shown in many text books. It is that if you suspend a magnet vertically opposite a rotating disc of conductive metal then a potential difference is generated between the inside and the outer edge of the disc. It has also been done where the magnet rotates with the disc! How large this voltage and current is was not described...but the thing is that the lines of force of the magnet are not broken as such so does not place a load on the motor driving it.....at least not in a conventional sense.

It may be something or nothing.....I feel that it could be an interaction between the earths magnetic field and the magnet....not as described in the document I read. It is a line of investigation I will try soon.

I know this is not hard science and it is...it is laboratory proffessors who have carried out this work. It is certainly open to ridicule but as with cold fussion there is an element of truth there that is being ignored. Simply it is a closed mind scoffing at something. To me scientific advancement can only come with an open mind willing to explore. A closed mind will never find anything except what you expect to find. An open mind will find answers and solutions. If we spent as much energy and money on searching for the truth rather than running people down because of our own beliefs we would be a much better society today than we are and a lot less dependent on that elixer they call oil.

Going into prediction mode...the oil crisis is much more than is being let on....we need oiless power today...tomorrow will be too late.

There are possibilities or avenues to explore.....keeping an open mind will bring one of them to life. Even if 99percent of them are impractical or the dreams of fools we owe it to ourselves and future generations to take more than a glance at them. To be truly scentific we need to set up completely foolproof experiments and view the results with an open mind and then still look to see if there is anything that we may have neglected. Remembering that nothing is foolproof and to be human is to ere.

Sorry on my box again!

Your question about arc lights and LED's

There is a big difference between the currents and voltages involved with driving an LED and an arc light.

I am not sure how much voltage an arc light uses but I think you are talking at least a hundered times different.

The LED's use about three volts at 0.03 amps while an arc light should use much higher voltages and currents.

From what I have seen of white LED's then they will illuminate on much lower voltages and currents and it seems to me that the garden LED's have a much lower than normal voltage to illuminate them. I suspect but have not confirmed it, white and Blue LED's may produce a higher frequency than natural light and use a phosphorescent material in the LED to change the frequency to one that you can see.

LED's depend on an electrons changing energy levels within an atom to produce a photon of light.....hence Red LED's need about two volts to produce red light, Green LED's need about 2.6 volts.....orange or yellow use a combination of materials of both green and red LED's to produce that colour. They have certainly produced tri colour leds this way using one green and one red LED in the same encapsulation.

The colour of the LED depends on the rare earth metals they use. Blue has been the hardest to produce and that is why I suspect a flourescent material. On this I may be wrong.

LED's certainly do not use the electric arc principle. I believe the first electric arcs used two carbon rods in near contact to each other to produce an electric arc which would require a reasonably high voltage to initiate but could be reduced to a certain extent once fired up.....then it would certainly depend on the amount of current passed. Again I may be wrong about the voltage aspect.

regards

Bernard

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(\"thenumbersix\")</div>
Doing a search on Stubblefield and carbon lamps I came up with this :

Stubblefield

TB.

More results to come soon, have finally caught up with my work and managed to survive the floods of Glastonbury (saw a free energy place almost every night but was shut and then could never locate it again in the day, wasn't meant to be I guess...) and now have a bit more time on my hands. I reckon I could knock up one of those Stubblefields' coil assemblies.

Am thinking two would be better to try and create a potential between the them, an interesting point in that link about the height difference, I have the perfect hill in mind to try it out with.

Am bored with measuring the volts on my two pipes, time to move onto the bigger and betterer ;)


Bernard

Welcome, have a good read through the thread, there may be other points in a similar thread of TimeBenders', is linked in the first post. Everything you need is here or linked to, have a go yourself, it is well worth the effort of bashing two bits of pipe into the ground :D

My next plan is to set up a series of the junk pipe cells to get enough volts to power a 3v LED, I want to get a measurement of current from it. Made a 4v battery out of a small potato cut in 4 and some screws n wires, has been dimly lighting an LED for two days now. I couldn't get a readable current from it, presuming I am doing it right which I'm pretty sure I am. My neighbour grows them, in case you were wondering, and I was bored watching him dig...

Am getting a steady 0.9v from the two bits of pipe so I'm hoping that 4 cells will be enough to light the LED. It came out of a Solar Charged Garden Light which I bought a the local garage, will also experiment with charging the batteries from the Earth Battery instead of solar and see how long it lasts....

More info :

Someone trying, by the looks of it, the Stubblefield Cell

Some good reading here (search through the text for arc lamps)

Stubblefield Meanderings

In fact this Google Search turns up loads of references to the ability of the power for his lamps on his farm. There's some mention of them always being hung from old / large trees and the power being drawn off near the root...Hills and trees are going to be my next target...


Just one question : How does a carbon arc lamp compare with an LED on a physical level, it seems to me that an LED is creating an ARC also ?[/b]
 

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