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The Grandmother Paradox
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<blockquote data-quote="MutableTimeLine" data-source="post: 320" data-attributes="member: 413"><p><strong>Re: The Grandmother Paradox</strong></p><p></p><p>Whew! This is pretty heavy. I'm new so I'll start with this. </p><p> </p><p>From someone's POV in 1973, there's a future world they're imagining with all sorts of high tech equipment like flying cars, not 30 GB IPods, or space travel and aliens not extremely gratifying movies about them. But since we are in their future we know how their lives turn out. As far as 55-year-old man in 2005 is concerned when he was 23 in '73, he never encountered his "older self." If you zap that guy back to '73 right now from his POV it'll be 1973 and he'll have NO clue how his actions are affecting "the future", if they even do, until he "returns." He could spend two months in 1973 and seem to fade in and out of three-dimensional space for two seconds from our viewpoints and some on-looker could say, "Nuthin happened!" Ultimately it depends on your frame of reference. (Like everyone here knows.) </p><p> </p><p>I like to believe people have choices to make. You could go out, get wasted as sh*t and drive home and likely get into an accident depending on the amount cars driving that night, where you live, etc. Or you could not leave the house, not drink and you won't be involved in an accident near your favorite pub, but someone else will. I can't speak for anyone else, but there are "X factors" you really can predict. You can make plans, but not results. "...even if your intentions are good, they can backfire drastically..." heeeee</p><p> </p><p>How can you monitor change before change happens? We grew up with a particular kind of knowledge. (For example, we all grew up knowing certain public figures were assassinated. If some ?goes back? and stops a death from happening, how would anyone growing up know that person was killed in another timeline?? I feel events can occur differently in one timeline. (Not to keen on the parallel theories, but still appreciate.)</p><p> </p><p>Anyway. My nanna paradox.</p><p> </p><p>I look at it like this. Say a time traveler named Steve decides to be an ass and journey to November 12, 1958, three months before his mother will be born. He decides to test the "grandmother paradox." He feels it can't happen and he'll "magically" reappear in his own time the instant his grandmother is killed. He breaks into the farm house and strangles his 33-year-old grandmother, Ruth. There are no witnesses to see the assailant suddenly vanish from three-dimensional space when the woman dies. The husband discovers Ruth ten minutes later when he returns from town. He calls the local police and the murder is investigated and eventually goes unsolved. The husband remarries two years later and starts a new family. </p><p> </p><p>This is an alternate reality from our perspective since we know about the future the traveler is from; a future in which he manages to construct a time machine and journey back forty-seven years to 1958 and kill his grandmother. He changed his past, so his future was radically different. We know the husband would never have remarried if his wife was not killed. BUT she was killed, by her grandson. The police could never figure this out of course since the fingerprint(s) will never match because the killer will never be born. But the physical evidence remains. The year 1958 was the present at one time, obviously. As time gradually passes and 2005 is the present year, the husband will take some time on November 12 and remember the wife and child he lost almost fifty years ago. It's sad, but that how it would happen in real life.</p><p> </p><p>Here's a little nugget: what if the next hit-and-run you hear about is actually a TT killing someone who in his/her time does something unspeakable and the TT is "righting wrongs." The event will never take place because the person is deceased. We'll never know about this event cause...how's it going happen? The "guilty party" is murdered before they can have some life-changing experience that makes them dangerous.</p><p> </p><p>*I like IooqxpooI's concise statement. Very, very good. But...what if the traveler gets scared and can't go through with it? Will someone else come along and murder little old nanna? Will a future version of the traveler be hidden from view watching him walk away thinking, "what a p***y. I'll take care of this." SHRUG.*</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="MutableTimeLine, post: 320, member: 413"] [b]Re: The Grandmother Paradox[/b] Whew! This is pretty heavy. I'm new so I'll start with this. From someone's POV in 1973, there's a future world they're imagining with all sorts of high tech equipment like flying cars, not 30 GB IPods, or space travel and aliens not extremely gratifying movies about them. But since we are in their future we know how their lives turn out. As far as 55-year-old man in 2005 is concerned when he was 23 in '73, he never encountered his "older self." If you zap that guy back to '73 right now from his POV it'll be 1973 and he'll have NO clue how his actions are affecting "the future", if they even do, until he "returns." He could spend two months in 1973 and seem to fade in and out of three-dimensional space for two seconds from our viewpoints and some on-looker could say, "Nuthin happened!" Ultimately it depends on your frame of reference. (Like everyone here knows.) I like to believe people have choices to make. You could go out, get wasted as sh*t and drive home and likely get into an accident depending on the amount cars driving that night, where you live, etc. Or you could not leave the house, not drink and you won't be involved in an accident near your favorite pub, but someone else will. I can't speak for anyone else, but there are "X factors" you really can predict. You can make plans, but not results. "...even if your intentions are good, they can backfire drastically..." heeeee How can you monitor change before change happens? We grew up with a particular kind of knowledge. (For example, we all grew up knowing certain public figures were assassinated. If some ?goes back? and stops a death from happening, how would anyone growing up know that person was killed in another timeline?? I feel events can occur differently in one timeline. (Not to keen on the parallel theories, but still appreciate.) Anyway. My nanna paradox. I look at it like this. Say a time traveler named Steve decides to be an ass and journey to November 12, 1958, three months before his mother will be born. He decides to test the "grandmother paradox." He feels it can't happen and he'll "magically" reappear in his own time the instant his grandmother is killed. He breaks into the farm house and strangles his 33-year-old grandmother, Ruth. There are no witnesses to see the assailant suddenly vanish from three-dimensional space when the woman dies. The husband discovers Ruth ten minutes later when he returns from town. He calls the local police and the murder is investigated and eventually goes unsolved. The husband remarries two years later and starts a new family. This is an alternate reality from our perspective since we know about the future the traveler is from; a future in which he manages to construct a time machine and journey back forty-seven years to 1958 and kill his grandmother. He changed his past, so his future was radically different. We know the husband would never have remarried if his wife was not killed. BUT she was killed, by her grandson. The police could never figure this out of course since the fingerprint(s) will never match because the killer will never be born. But the physical evidence remains. The year 1958 was the present at one time, obviously. As time gradually passes and 2005 is the present year, the husband will take some time on November 12 and remember the wife and child he lost almost fifty years ago. It's sad, but that how it would happen in real life. Here's a little nugget: what if the next hit-and-run you hear about is actually a TT killing someone who in his/her time does something unspeakable and the TT is "righting wrongs." The event will never take place because the person is deceased. We'll never know about this event cause...how's it going happen? The "guilty party" is murdered before they can have some life-changing experience that makes them dangerous. *I like IooqxpooI's concise statement. Very, very good. But...what if the traveler gets scared and can't go through with it? Will someone else come along and murder little old nanna? Will a future version of the traveler be hidden from view watching him walk away thinking, "what a p***y. I'll take care of this." SHRUG.* [/QUOTE]
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