minuteman project and Waco type events thread

[CaryP]

Re: minuteman project... waco type event???

posted by Crosstika:

ok this is it then i'm capoot ?

Is that a promise or a threat? And it's German, as in kaput, but in your case "i'm capoot" probably works best, especially the "poot" part. Although, according to Merriam Webster:

Main Entry: ka?put
1 : utterly finished, defeated, or destroyed
2 : unable to function : USELESS <my battery went kaput -- Henry James Jr.>
3 : hopelessly outmoded

Yeah, that about sums YOU up, Jesus Bush / Crosswit.

To Darkwold, Paul, Harte, Sosue, StarLord, artsouth, Pyro and anyone else out there. Let's leave dumbass to himself. He's proved repeatedly that no matter what you say, he attacks you because you're (pick one or more) a bigot, white supremist, racist, nazi, confomist, Hitler, insecure, Evangelical Christian, and now he's a "poot". Let's leave ol' Jesus Bush/ Crass-tika to himself, and not respond to him. He's just looking for a fight. Based on his posts, we're all wrong, and he's the only one with any insight. Yeah, right. I suspect something besides him is driving his posts, something of the chemical variety, but that's just my guess.

To Kira, lastdyingtree and/or Grayson. BAN PLEASE, before ol' pooter here makes an even bigger mess.

Cary

 

[KiraSjon]

Re: minuteman project... waco type event???

Back.

1) Thanks for posting that, Mom. My internet was down all night from the storm.

2) I'm done reading this garbage. It's turned into nothing but bashing. If you all could calm down for 5 minutes and speak to one another rationally and LISTEN you would realize that you ALL have valid points. Apparently you cannot.

I am closing this thread. Boss G, if you don't like this, then let me know.

Y'all feel free to open a new thread and try to debate like civilized people again.

 

[Grayson]

Re: minuteman project... waco type event???

1: Mom, thanks for helping Kira out here.

2: Kira, you da boss here girl.

3: Cary, nicely done Suh.

4: Darkwolf, Artsouth, Paul J Lyon, Starlord and Pyro99 thanks for standing together and showing Svastika what we mean by family here.

5: Svastika, you had a brain, what did you do to it?


Medals all round I think.

 

[optimist]

minuteman project continued

Hope I'm not making a sin here as I realize that the last MMP thread got closed. But I think this is an important event, and hopefully it won't end up Waco-like. Even if it doesn't IMHO Gilchrist is doing something that borders on brillant in terms of a citizen action. If there is any hope for averting the dark future that JT forcast, it is in the people setting the terms of the political debate before it's too late. Yeeha!

 

[optimist]

Re: minuteman project continued

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-gi...util-news-local

PROFILE | JAMES GILCHRIST

One Man's Convictions Launched a Border Crusade
By Jennifer Delson
Times Staff Writer

April 11, 2005
Amid the lush canyons in southern Orange County, a retired accountant living quietly on his wife's humble salary and Social Security disability benefits cooked up a plan that drew attention from two presidents and reporters around the globe last week..
Last fall, Vietnam veteran James Gilchrist, 56, was listening to George Putnam's talk show on KCAA-AM (1050). He often listens to conservative radio shows in his small home office in an Aliso Viejo planned community, where he proudly displays his Purple Heart and dog tags.
He heard a guest on the show, Chris Simcox, complain about lax border enforcement. His words resonated with Gilchrist, who long wondered why communities in Orange County teemed with people who don't speak English.
Gilchrist called Simcox, a veteran crusader against illegal immigrants at the Arizona border.
"Things came out that were in my head swimming around for years," Gilchrist said. "It was a culmination of fears building up."
Gilchrist vowed to get volunteers to guard a border he believed the federal government had neglected. He quickly found hundreds of supporters through the Internet, among them fellow veterans and retired U.S. Border Patrol agents.
And so the Minuteman Project was born. A combination of citizen posse and media attention-getter, Gilchrist's brainchild took shape April 1 on an unforgiving strip of Arizona desert, with nearly as many reporters as volunteers.
The Minutemen plan to stay through the month, alerting U.S. Customs and Border Protection agents when they spot people illegally crossing into the United States.
That Gilchrist and Simcox chose Arizona is no surprise. The Arizona border became more popular among immigrants and drug smugglers after barriers were improved at borders in Texas and California. Nearly half of the 1.1 million apprehensions of illegal immigrants last year were in southern Arizona, according to the Department of Homeland Security.
Renewed attention to illegal border crossings helped propel passage of Arizona's Proposition 200, which requires proof of immigration status to qualify for some state benefits, including general assistance, short-term crisis aid and child-care assistance. Voters approved the measure 56% to 44% in November.
The Minutemen, who arrived with guns, private planes and night-vision goggles, have promised a strict "no contact" rule in approaching immigrants. Their presence on a 23-mile strip in southeast Arizona nonetheless alarmed local and federal officials, Mexican authorities and immigrants' advocates. Days before the volunteers arrived, the Department of Homeland Security declared it would double air surveillance and transfer 534 agents to the area, a 20% increase in its force there. The aircraft and nearly half the new agents have already arrived, although Border Patrol officials say they were planned prior to the Minuteman action.
Mexican President Vicente Fox has increased troop strength along the border and asked the U.S. to protect border crossers from harm. President Bush, who has called for a temporary workers' visa program, called the group vigilantes.
For Gilchrist, who says he is haunted by the images of friends who died in combat more than 30 years ago, the campaign has become a new war.
Within arm's reach of his desk in his home office is a published book, the size of a telephone directory, listing all the U.S. service personnel killed in action. He highlighted in yellow the names of all Marines who served with him in Vietnam. Gilchrist said he was a corporal in charge of spotting enemy positions.
Many of his comrades died in an ambush south of Khe Sanh in 1968, he said. It is in large part because of this vivid memory that Gilchrist fights on.
Framed 5-by-7-inch photographs of six fallen comrades hang in an entryway between Gilchrist's garage and kitchen.
"I don't want this country to end up like they did, dead on that battlefield," said Gilchrist. "Too many immigrants will divide our country. We are not going to have a civil war now, but we could."
Gilchrist hails from a military family. He said his father served 27 years in the U.S. Navy, in combat areas during World War II and the Korean War and stateside during the Vietnam War. He retired in 1968. His mother helped train Navy fighter pilots during World War II.
Gilchrist, who enlisted, spent 13 months in Vietnam, where he was wounded in the face by gunfire. It changed his life. Years later, he said, a rupture in the dura, the material that covers the brain led to three brain surgeries between 1986 and 1990. Doctors assumed that the rupture was related to his wartime wounds, Gilchrist said.
Gilchrist worked for years as an accountant and closed his own practice in 1995. A native of Rhode Island, he has been married for 10 years; his wife has two adult children, one of whom married a Mexican immigrant.
Gilchrist made his home in Orange County, living in several cities before buying in Aliso Viejo nearly 10 years ago, before prices shot up, he explained. Free during the day, he spent months doing home renovations, including installing hardwood floors.
While he worked, he listened to talk radio. It stirred up his feelings about cities where he had lived, including Westminster, which now has a large Vietnamese community.
"We are becoming a country run by mob rule. Whoever moves in rules," Gilchrist said. "I'm worried about the illegal immigration. I can see our country splitting apart."
Immigrants' advocates argue that Gilchrist, Simcox and others tend to use hyperbole that cannot be supported by statistics. For example, the Minuteman Project website says "tens of millions" of illegal aliens are "invading" the country.
There are an estimated 8 million to 12 million undocumented immigrants living in the U.S., according to the Department of Homeland Security. It is difficult to estimate how many cross each year, but authorities made 1.1 million apprehensions along the border last year.
Said Leo Chavez, anthropology professor at UC Irvine: "The issue of illegal immigration is political. All we need to do is allow more people to enter this country legally."
Local Arizona ranchers, meanwhile, remain leery of outsiders. But some said they appreciated the increased attention to the illegal immigrants crossing the land they own or lease from the federal government.
Ron Stone, a rancher in Douglas, Ariz., who brought a single-engine plane to help look for illegal immigrants, said Gilchrist "is getting people to pay attention to us. We need that."
Though prone to vitriolic language ? "Illegal immigrants will destroy this country," he said during a recent interview ? Gilchrist often softens his tone. "These people are coming here for work," he added after some reflection. "We need to ask why that is happening."
But his thoughts inevitably flow to Vietnam. "What ? did all these people die for in World War II, Korea and Vietnam?" he asked. "It was not so we would turn into a country of mayhem."
*
(BEGIN TEXT OF INFOBOX)
Formative events
?* About thirty years ago, James Gilchrist worked for 18 months as a newspaper reporter for the Providence Journal Bulletin in Rhode Island. He left journalism because, he said, it seemed unusually cutthroat.
?* In the early 1980s, Gilchrist's car was struck by a car driven by two Latino men; he said he believes they were illegal immigrants because their car's plates did not match the vehicle they were issued to.
?* On Sept. 18, 2001, Gilchrist wrote letters to senators, congressman and President Bush blaming them for the deaths that month at the World Trade Center and the Pentagon because they had failed to stop the terrorists before they acted.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[Crosstika]

Re: minuteman project continued

{B]Border Militia: We'll Shut Down the Border with Machine Guns[/B]

Casey Nethercott is the leader of a militia group dubbed the Arizona Guard and said during a TV interview broadcast on Friday, "When this Minuteman thing is over, if it doesn't work, we're going to come out here and close the border with machine guns."

KVOA TV-4 in Tucson carried a report on Friday by reporter Nancy Perla that toured the group's compound that sits along the Arizona/Mexico border near Douglas, Arizona. The camera showed two older model American made SUV's, both painted black, that Nethercott claims are "armored vehicles" with "quarter-inch steel in them." Pointing again to the vehicles, Nethercott continued, "You'll get killed without them, here's been so many shootouts out here."

The camera then shows a concrete block wall riddled with bullet holes that Nethercott says came from drug smugglers. The report titled "Mimicman Projects" by KVOA calls them copy cats and says the project could begin on July 4, though Nethercott would release no details.

The Minuteman Project stated through Chris Simcox, who is an organizer for the project, that they don't support a violent solution. "I think anytime you go to that length to take the law into your own hands, you're asking for trouble," Simcox told KVOA.

The armed militia supports the Minuteman Project, but says that if they fail to close the border to illegal border crossers, his group will step in and be heavily armed to do the job.

 

[CaryP]

Re: minuteman project continued

Way to go Optimist. You got it cranked up again. Thanks pal. Okay let's keep this thing going here. If the old thread is opened at some point, we can always merge the threads. Sosue and I moderate this thread, so it ain't gettin' shut down. We might have to "smack some rude folks around a bit" but no need to close it. Okay? Everybody down with this? Let's hope so. Have a great night.

Cary

 

[artsouth]

Re: minuteman project continued

great .... im glad to see this,as it is important...its history...

 

[artsouth]

Re: minuteman project continued

thanks optimist.......

 

[artsouth]

Re: minuteman project continued

Mexican Army Escorts
Border Drug-Runners
Minutemen, US Officials Say Military Directs
Illegals To Avoid Arizona Patrols
? 2005 WorldNetDaily.com
4-13-5


WASHINGTON ? The Mexican army is escorting those attempting to cross over the U.S. border illegally ? including known drug-runners ? to areas not patrolled by the Minuteman Project near Naco, Ariz., say Border Patrol sources and other officials including a U.S. congressman.

Rep. Tom Tancredo, R-Colo., chairman of the Congressional Immigration Reform Caucus, denounced the action by the Mexican military and called on President Bush to do the same.

"President Bush should publicly denounce Mexico's latest act to curb U.S. law," said Tancredo. "The president of Mexico is threatening to sue any member of the Minutemen who have contact with a Mexican national, threatening to take the U.S. into the International Court of Justice at the Hague over the passage of Prop 200 in Arizona, and is providing transportation to Mexican nationals trying to sneak into the U.S. One could say he is acting in the best interest of his nation. Isn't it unfortunate we cannot say the same thing about President Bush?"

Grey Deacon, a spokesman for the Minuteman Project, reported illegal immigration is down considerably from previous months in the area patrolled by the U.S. citizen volunteers trying to bring attention to the problem of the porous border. While he claimed credit for 241 Minuteman-assisted apprehensions by the Border Patrol in the week since the project began, he pointed out the 23-mile section of the border normally sees thousands of crossing attempts a day while they have been numbered in the dozens a day since the project began.

He said the Minutemen aided today in the capture of a "coyote," a professional human smuggler.

"But the traffic is down because the Mexican military is leading illegal aliens, including drug smugglers, away from the area of the border we are patrolling," he said.

Border Patrol sources say the Mexican army recently moved about 1,000 troops to the Agua Prieta region, just south of where the Minutemen are. These troops, the sources say, are diverting all of the illegal alien and drug-smuggling traffic away from the Minutemen.

Just prior to the launch of the Minuteman Project March 30, Miguel Escobar Valdez, Mexican consul in Douglas, Ariz., said the Mexican military was bracing for possible violence on the border.

"The Mexican army is on alert," Escobar said. "Also, law enforcement will be vigilant because the situation is very volatile. This is because, I have to say it, there are violent and radical elements on both sides of the border."

The Minuteman Project is a group of about 1,000 U.S. volunteers patrolling the U.S. side of the border on a 23-mile stretch in Arizona near Naco. When they spot illegal aliens crossing the border, they alert Border Patrol agents to make arrests. The members plan to stay through the end of April.

The volunteers focused on the border area near Naco because it had become one of the highest traffic corridors for border-crossing illegal aliens. Last year, more than 40 percent of the 1.15 million illegal aliens caught by the Border Patrol were taken into custody in the southern Arizona region.

? 2005 WorldNetDaily.com, Inc.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article....RTICLE_ID=43754