Is organized religion bad?

[gonzogirl]

Re: Is organized Religion BAD?

I think everyone needs to chill and remember that what's been said about these folks so far is only based on a single telephone call supposedly from some young girl at the ranch that they have never located - and the phone used to call the report in (anonymously) belongs to a person that has made false reports to police before.

Whatever these folks are doing, I hesitate to call them "pervs" until I know for a fact it is so.

In fact, I'm floored that nobody at this site has been complaining about the obvious violation of the rights of these children and their families that has taken place. (Where have you gone, Chip Lewis?)

These kids have been separated from their parents based on a single anonymous phone call from a person the cops have yet to locate.

What if none of it is true?

I mean, yeah, underage marriage and whatnot. But hey, there arelaws and nobody has been charged with any crime yet, despite the fact that it's been two weeks or so.

Did parents force their underage daughters to marry older men there? How can we say?

Harte

IMO...No violation of rights here. DHS has a duty to protect kids from those circumstances that endanger them..I bet if all this was not within the law..the kids would be back right now. The LDS factions have good lawyers...And I think...Yes they force the kids to do all sorts of things. These kind of "communes" are in some states. What propells the law in a lot of cases is the fraud against the fed gov. Like the women getting benefits and not naming the father..so that ALL the wives can collect cash and food stamps....and the man isnt named. The gov dont like out right fraud up in its face. Reports like these have been going around since the late eighties..I think Texas just has more balls than Utah. The Texas DHS has the authority to do what it is doing. The LDS faction's lawyers cant make a case for the clients because there is sufficent and probable cause to remove the kids. What the kids are saying to DHS is what is keeping them in protective custody.
Anonymous calls can save lives sometimes.
I rely on things that people say happened to them when they were in this specific group. These people are not writing books or anything..And what they say scares the crap out of me..
I know that nothing is proven (yet)..but I have a feeling that the poo poo is gonna hit the fan for these folks. I hope the women dont get away with this stuff. As far as the question..Do these parents force the underage girls to marry 50 yr olds? How do we know for sure.?
Well I can answer it this way......
What 14 year old wants to marry some way older guy and start cranking out babies and thats it?...
I dont think too many would want to if truth B told.
I mean they way you, Harte said.."Yeah, Underage marrige and whatnot" Sounds too flip to me. like you dont understand the seriousness of underage marrige..Especially forced marriage. This is danerous..I dont think that ALL of these girls were like.."yeah..that sounds good. Get me married at 14 and my "husband" will later on, marry my younger sister!" dont sound like a choice many women would make.
I dont care how these kids are raised..it just isnt cool and these girls know it......these girls know that this is brainwashing and the American version of the Taliban is alive and well!

 

[kcwildman]

Re: Is organized Religion BAD?

well folks it looks like the (organized religion is bad) is about to be a real frase, and it looks like there starting with the Mormans/L.D.S. cult/religion.
after the news of late from the great state of Texas, and the horriable things reported. we are faced with a real problem. do we realy have a rite to interfear with the privet lives of church members/or any free American????? if we look at the marriage laws from all 50 states. like it or not, there are provisions for under age marrage in all of them. yes even Texas. now don't get me wrong on this, OK, if it was my daughter of 12/14/16 they were trying to marry off to some 50 yr old perv. they would not need a warrent to find him. just go down to the county moruge, he'll be waiting for ya just a laying there nice and quiet, right where I left him.
but thats just me, and I am kinda funny that way bout people f*%&ing with my kids/your kids/anybodys kids. and I will say it here and now, for all the world to see and hear, if I see anyone torrmenting a child. it will be the last thing they do above the dirt. this old dog will fight, if ya rattle his cage. now that said, it will be very interesting to see how this plays out. if they strip these people of there parrental rights, and take the kids. in this case, if the reports are true, I would say good, get those kids away from the childmolesters. however, this will start a trend to just say any church is a bad place, and move against it with the full force of the goons squads. it is also most likely a test to see what the sheep will do. if its legal for them to marry off there daughters under Texas law. we better not let them set a pressident of we the gov. don't like you, so your screwed. theres alot going on here to be watchfull of, and GOD help us to see it.
P.S. seems they have set up a mobile unit to do DNA testing on all the kids checking for incest. not to sure if I like that, but we have to know what went on there so I guess its ok for now. if they do prove incest whitch they prob will. it will be the last straw for me, I mean I try to give evryone an equal chance to prove there assholyness befor I tear them a new one, but this crap is way over the top
poppye sindrome yep,yep,yep get a rope boys

P.S.S. again
well the wife has been hot on this story from the getgo, and it looks like bout 20 or better of the so called grown women, are in fact under the age of 17,( just kids themselves) and some have as many as four kids. don't sound good for the old men. also just heard theres a bunch of infants and toddlers with bone fractures. the story seems to get worse every day.it's almost to much to believe. oh yeh from what the wife says they are real close to filing formal charges against the pervs. both the horney old childmolester males and the weekminded brainwashed moms who watched and did nothing to protect there daughters.

 

[gonzogirl]

Re: Is organized Religion BAD?

P.S.S. again
well the wife has been hot on this story from the getgo, and it looks like bout 20 or better of the so called grown women, are in fact under the age of 17,( just kids themselves) and some have as many as four kids. don't sound good for the old men. also just heard theres a bunch of infants and toddlers with bone fractures. the story seems to get worse every day.it's almost to much to believe. oh yeh from what the wife says they are real close to filing formal charges against the pervs. both the horney old childmolester males and the weekminded brainwashed moms who watched and did nothing to protect there daughters.

Yes. The one thing that has pissed me off is that some of the older moms are asking for their "kids" back. They are talking about their own kids wha are young teenage bride mothers. If they think that they are grown up enough to be a 16 yr old mom then stop calling them children. I mean these women will pimp out their kids and tell them they are women but when the law gets involved the 16 yr olds all of a sudden become "children". I have a feeling it will get weirder as the days go by ..keep me posted in case I miss something...
I am not watching alot of news right now because I am developing an anger prob.......

 

[kcwildman]

Re: Is organized Religion BAD?

no prob. there Gonzo
I am sure the wife will be starrin hard at these events.so any news I get from her, I will put up here. for all to see.
but at this point it's getting hard for me to not be very judgemental. like you I am developing an anger issue with these people(and I use that term loosley here)

 

[Harte]

Re: Is organized Religion BAD?

I just read in yesterday's paper that half of the teens that were rounded up had either had babies or were pregnant right now, so it don't look good.

Here's another problem, though, with them busting in on these people on such a slim piece of evidence as an anonymous phone call.

A decent lawyer might get any evidence seized during the raid - including testimony - thrown out of court based on no "reasonable grounds" or whatever the legalese for it is.

Harte

 

[kcwildman]

Re: Is organized Religion BAD?

yeh thats the catch 22 hear.
if we don't move on an anonymous call and someone dies we get pissed, scream for the C.P.S. worker to be hung/fired/sued/sent to jail
if we do move on the call and its boggus we get pissed
at least this time it appears the system is working

 

[gl100]

Re: Is organized Religion BAD?

H,

I would think the courts would consider it justifiable under the umbrella of probable cause. The state agencies involved acted on good faith vis a vis the potential for crimes against juveniles. Anonymous phone tips are a large part of current day law enforcement.

I'm somewhat perplexed by the phone call itself. Although it may have been a "hoax", it was grounded in fact and did accuse a prior member by name. Possibly it was a direct attack against that particular member and the hoaxer wasn't aware he had left and moved to Arizona.

Gotta love this state. We do have our share of bizarre crimes and criminals. Now we have a dead guy down here, shot by the cops, who everyone claims was ex-CIA except the CIA and the FBI have no idea of who he is. Here's the story. Fascinating.

Man killed by HPD still an enigma despite CIA mementos | Chron.com - Houston Chronicle

 

[kcwildman]

Re: Is organized Religion BAD?

very odd indeed-----aaahhh my name is nobody,I work for the C.I.A. heres my GOV. ID.
another time when the P.D. sees only a trafic ticket, and persues at all cost to collect. a man dead for 250 dollar fine, and no-one even knows who he realy is/was. only in AMERICA.

 

[gl100]

Re: Is organized Religion BAD?

Actually KC, the man is dead because he refused to exit his vehicle and when he finally did, he did not do as he was told and made an overt gesture thought to be menacing by the cops on hand. Also, they did find several handgus and a shotgun in the vehicle. Perhaps they were a little quick on the trigger but seeing as they just went to trial on a guy who killed a cop while handcuffed from the back of a cruiser, I can understand their nervousness.

I'm way more intrigued by the fact that the man's friends and relatives claim he was an operative, his house is full of CIA type paraphernalia, he was carrying CIA id and yet, nobody in law enforcement claims to know who the hell he is.

 

[kcwildman]

Re: Is organized Religion BAD?

my point exactly, the man was way to connected to be so dumb as to make a dangerous move with a dozen cops pointing guns at him.
and from the cops I have known, and seen in action. there were at least a dozen all around him once he stopped with guns drawn.
he would have known better, and he would have handeled the instance way diffrantly. it just sounds way to convieant.
he moved,I told him not to but he moved anyway, so I shot him dead. now I can tell the story the way I want to. seems way to easy point the finger at him.
it will be interesting to see what comes of it huh. who he turns out to realy be,just where he realy worked, and just what he was working on of late.
please keep us up date on this one