Civil Rights and You: A study in modern extinction.

[K@t 5]

Civil Rights and You: A study in modern extinction.

I started this thread because I noticed that other people were having difficulties figuring out where to post certain things. Things that are definitely civil rights based are being placed in the Waco thread, and causing a little confusion. Hopefully, this clears things up.

My hubby and I were running around town the other day, and happened to notice a sign that was on the doors of a local art supply store (for those that care it?s Hobby Lobby). Granted, the sign was on the inside of the store, so we didn?t see it until we left. The sign said something to the extent that the store had recently passed a rule that allowed it to search not only your person, any bags or parcels on you, detain and question you at any time, but that they also had the right to search your vehicle in the parking lot if they so choose.

WHAT??!!!???

Since when does a store have the right to do this? And why, in the name of all that?s holy, is this sign not posted in plain sight of the customers entering the store??!!?? Fine, if you?re stupid enough to shop lift and get caught, I can see them searching you. If you?re acting ?suspicious?, while that?s really stretching it, maybe. However, there is no way that they should be able to search your vehicle without a warrant. Maybe Darkwolf could shed some light on that particular part for me, as my hubby and I were really confused.

Just a little more evidence that our country is going to hell in a hand basket.

 

[The_Ruffneck]

Re: Civil Rights and You: A study in modern extinction.

why don't you ask them? unless the mere thought of asking them would be classed as suspicious and a searchable offence lol

 

[Time Rider]

Re: Civil Rights and You: A study in modern extinction.

I'm glad you posted this.

Interesting how it's happening ALL so subtly. And our country is so big and has so many people that I can see how it can and apparantly is happening with such subtlty.

Something happened to me and my mom at a rug shop last year in Dallas- no, I don't remember the name of the shop but when my mom went to make her purchase, she was asked to be fingerprinted. My mom was just going to let her do it and I said "No she's not- at least not before she talks to an attorney." That kinda scared the cashier and she said not to worry about it.
Mom made her purchase and we were on our way.

Mom paid cash, by the way.

After I started thinking about it, I was unsettled, then I got riled up.

If we all resist these subtlties, maybe.... we can win the war that is being fought against our civil rights.

Sharon

 

[Zoomerz]

Re: Civil Rights and You: A study in modern extinction.

These types of civil infringements are not new. They've been going on for many years. In general (and correct me if I'm wrong here Paul), signs like these mean very little, and often-times assume authority where it doesn't exist. Also, MOST OFTEN, when tested in court, they don't hold up.

Stores generally do have the right to refuse service to anyone they wish, however, a person cannot implicitly (or explicitly for that matter) sign away their constitutional rights. Therefore, in court, agreements made that would violate those rights would normally be put down.

This has created a "gridlock" of sorts between business and consumers in cases where someone might want to "expidite" a process, sign a paper (for example), and receive some benefit. Business is generally put in a position whereby it cannot at times even offer a product for fear of liability issues.

I don't think business is trying to directly deny civil rights. They are trying to reduce risk, that's all. In doing so, they often DO, in fact, violate constitutional freedoms. But again, these are "assumed" authorities, and often fail in court.

MHO

Z-

 

[Darkwolf]

Re: Civil Rights and You: A study in modern extinction.

Maybe Darkwolf could shed some light on that particular part for me, as my hubby and I were really confused.

I sure can. There way the heck out of line, criminaly so if they actually do what the sign describes. In colorado, store employees can detain and search a subject only if they see them commit a crime. In most cases this means concealing goods. They have absolutly no right to search cars. If they want that done, they must have probable cause to detain the subject, and then call law enforcement. (I think they can search if they actually see somone put stolen merchandise in their car) If they just decide to detain and search somone for no reason, there are not only a number of civil remidies but criminal charges including false imprisonment. Thats a serious one. Assult if they use physical force, menacing if they threaten to.

 

[Judge Bean]

Re: Civil Rights and You: A study in modern extinction.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(\"Darkwolf\")</div>

I sure can. There way the heck out of line, criminaly so if they actually do what the sign describes. In colorado, store employees can detain and search a subject only if they see them commit a crime. In most cases this means concealing goods. They have absolutly no right to search cars. If they want that done, they must have probable cause to detain the subject, and then call law enforcement. (I think they can search if they actually see somone put stolen merchandise in their car) If they just decide to detain and search somone for no reason, there are not only a number of civil remidies but criminal charges including false imprisonment. Thats a serious one. Assult if they use physical force, menacing if they threaten to.[/b]

This is right. There is no Constitutional issue here unless the store security personnel are somehow acting as agents for the police-- difficult to prove most of the time, although sometimes they'll tell the guard over the phone to search the purse. Otherwise, the guard can get the merchandise back, and, if a scuffle ensues, the thief can be charged with robbery. The guard can also detain a theft suspect for a "reasonable time" to secure the property and obtain information about the suspected thief.

 

[Darkwolf]

Re: Civil Rights and You: A study in modern extinction.

In this state, security personell, or anyone making a citizen's arrest may search the subject's person for their own safety. They can search a bag or something like that if they witnessed the subject shoplift. However a car is the legal extention of the home, so most of the same search rules apply.

 

[K@t 5]

Re: Civil Rights and You: A study in modern extinction.

Thanks guys!! I'm going to try and get a pic of the sign this weekend. If we manage it, it'll be posted by Tues.

Zoom, I understand that this is not a new thing. It's just the first time that I have seen a store do something that blatant. My issue is that, for the most part, the majority of the customers walking in there won't even think twice about the sign if they see it (remember, it was on the doors as you walk out, not in). How many of the sheeple are going to dig in their heels and say, "Wait a minute...I DON'T THINK SO!!" Unfortunately, not many. This was an issue where I was genuinely confused as to how a store could assume that type of authority. Nothing in the sign said, "We will have an officer detain you". I'm still kinda dumbfounded by it...

 

[Darkwolf]

Re: Civil Rights and You: A study in modern extinction.

<H2>New city police cars will have cameras

[font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]tactical units more storage space for equipment, Picardi said.</H2>[/font]

 

[thenumbersix]

Re: Civil Rights and You: A study in modern extinction.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(\"K@t 5\")</div>

Thanks guys!! I'm going to try and get a pic of the sign this weekend. If we manage it, it'll be posted by Tues.[/b]

Before you do, look for the sign saying :

Use of photographic equipment or any recording device is prohibited and will result in the transfer of ownership of your camera, anything on you and all other worldy goods to the proprietor. Reading of this sign signifies your agreement of these terms. Thank you for your custom, come again.