🛡️ Debate Alternative, or Misunderstood Medicine?

[Ayasano]

The fact is, frozen and canned NEVER lack in vitamins at all. It is the FRESH veggies that can lack in vitamins.

And smoking can add years to your life and cure TB,...

You have a good one Harte.

Honestly, you're both wrong. It depends on the type of fruit or vegetable. Some have more nutrients in fresh form, some have more in canned/frozen form. The most important part is whether or not they were fully ripe when picked, as unripe fresh produce will have far less nutrients than ripe frozen/canned produce.

Frozen vs. Fresh? Which Vegetables Are Best

 

[Sue]

I think that the majority of our food now is toxic.. Even when we buy seeds to plant our own organic gardens, how do we know those seeds are gmo free? I think we are all screwed from being "completely" organic, toxic free unlike our ancient ancestors.. I believe in vitamins and I eat as healthy as I can.. This topic got way off subject lol.. I still believe in complimentary medicine.. I'll take a little alternative and a little scientific to make a complete complimentary medicine.. No blanket statement from me on either side.. Sitting on the fence with both is my comfort

 

[Ayasano]

I think that the majority of our food now is toxic.. Even when we buy seeds to plant our own organic gardens, how do we know those seeds are gmo free? I think we are all screwed from being "completely" organic, toxic free unlike our ancient ancestors.. I believe in vitamins and I eat as healthy as I can.. This topic got way off subject lol.. I still believe in complimentary medicine.. I'll take a little alternative and a little scientific to make a complete complimentary medicine.. No blanket statement from me on either side.. Sitting on the fence with both is my comfort

Well, I think part of the problem is that people assume all GMO = bad, which just isn't true, just as natural does not necessarily equal healthy. Farmers have been growing GMO crops for thousands of years via hybridization and artificial selection, that's how we got bananas that are yellow and curvy, not green and fat and basically inedible. Doing it in a lab is just more accurate, and thus less prone to ending up with a strain that all dies to a single disease outbreak, or something. Sure, lab-based GMO opens the door to more nefarious modifications, but so does hybridization/artificial selection, just on a longer time scale. (Looking at you, Monsanto)

"Natural" Banana

"GMO" Banana

Which would you rather eat?

 

[Sue]

I believe that some GMO is definitely better.. It's determining where they draw the line.. Hawaiian papayas would be completely gone if not for GMO.. My statement is to not put faith or make a blanket statement about anything.. Can GMO be healthy? Yes.. Can GMO be unhealthy? Yes.. Can vitamins be healthy? Yes.. Can vitamins be unhealthy?!? Yes.. There's no blanket statements here.. I believe all things can be beneficial alternative and scientific but like everything else in life (in moderation).. That's where I stand in such things..

 

[PaulaJedi]

IDK about the jobs argument.. So far, I been helping folks awhile with my frequency generators... They aint violet ray tubes. I can use square or sine but the lines do need to be percise , no trapezoidal, no triangle , the wave form has to be square or sine. And their are lots of youtube videos demonstrating the effect I think that had to of been part of the reason things like novocure and insightec got the full FDA go ahead, BUt for the Chemo.. First you get chemo, then you get morphine, then you get told to go home and make yourself comfortable ...... JObs got 9 more years?

What was he doing near perfectly that could be better understood and better utilized? What ever it was, it wern't chemo.

How do YOU diagnose people with cancer?

 

[ElementalDissonance]

I can weigh in on the cooked vs uncooked vitamin argument. In my understanding, if you don't heat the food to break it down, your body will. Vitamins that are cooked out through heat are still cooked out, especially if combined with baking or overeating.

However, minerals are not (generally) lost through heat, but through leaching that takes place when boiling in water. And then the minerals aren't truly lost unless you throw out the water.

That's why steaming's the best of both worlds. The boiling temperature of water limits the heat to 100 Celsius, and the fact that the food is not immersed in the water that heats it means that not many minerals leach out.

And yes, I've read about frozen fruits and vegetables being picked ripe and therefore containing more vitamins (except I believe, for B-12, which is partially lost when freezing; and some other vitamins that are partially lost when blanching). I'd never heard the same argument for canned foods, though.

But I do agree that both probably have a good deal more nutritional value than groceries that were picked unripe, shipped for a week or more overseas, artificially ripened and left in a grocery store aisle for a week before being bought, and then left sitting on a shelf for a week before being eaten. Isn't that why they say that a lot of oranges have far less vitamin C than we've been led to believe?

To be honest, it's hard to tell what exactly is true because you have what seem like very intelligent people vehemently arguing both sides, supported by conflicting "facts" that have supposedly been proven by "expert" scientists.

 

[Ayasano]

I can weigh in on the cooked vs uncooked vitamin argument. In my understanding, if you don't heat the food to break it down, your body will. Vitamins that are cooked out through heat are still cooked out, especially if combined with baking or overeating.

However, minerals are not (generally) lost through heat, but through leaching that takes place when boiling in water. And then the minerals aren't truly lost unless you throw out the water.

That's why steaming's the best of both worlds. The boiling temperature of water limits the heat to 100 Celsius, and the fact that the food is not immersed in the water that heats it means that not many minerals leach out.

And yes, I've read about frozen fruits and vegetables being picked ripe and therefore containing more vitamins (except I believe, for B-12, which is partially lost when freezing; and some other vitamins that are partially lost when blanching). I'd never heard the same argument for canned foods, though.

But I do agree that both probably have a good deal more nutritional value than groceries that were picked unripe, shipped for a week or more overseas, artificially ripened and left in a grocery store aisle for a week before being bought, and then left sitting on a shelf for a week before being eaten. Isn't that why they say that a lot of oranges have far less vitamin C than we've been led to believe?

To be honest, it's hard to tell what exactly is true because you have what seem like very intelligent people vehemently arguing both sides, supported by conflicting "facts" that have supposedly been proven by "expert" scientists.

I think the takeaway, and the point I was trying to make, is that instead of making a blanket statement either way, you have to research the individual type of food and method of preparation. And if it really matters to you, I'm sure you could figure out a way to measure the amount of nutrients in a specific piece of food at home.

Personally, I'll just stick with buying frozen food from ASDA because it's convenient and I don't have the energy or time to cook beyond chucking some stuff into the oven for 20 minutes. It's not the healthiest option, but I have bigger fish to fry, lifestyle-wise.

 

[titorite]

IDK about the jobs argument.. So far, I been helping folks awhile with my frequency generators... They aint violet ray tubes. I can use square or sine but the lines do need to be percise , no trapezoidal, no triangle , the wave form has to be square or sine. And their are lots of youtube videos demonstrating the effect I think that had to of been part of the reason things like novocure and insightec got the full FDA go ahead, BUt for the Chemo.. First you get chemo, then you get morphine, then you get told to go home and make yourself comfortable ...... JObs got 9 more years?

What was he doing near perfectly that could be better understood and better utilized? What ever it was, it wern't chemo.

How do YOU diagnose people with cancer?

I don't do any diagnosing. I can't. I rely on people having good regular contact with their doctors. I prefer to be able to read lab results and such. With out a good and proper diagnosis I am just shooting in the dark. With a good proper diagnoses I can be super effective.

 

[Ayasano]

I don't do any diagnosing. I can't. I rely on people having good regular contact with their doctors. I prefer to be able to read lab results and such. With out a good and proper diagnosis I am just shooting in the dark. With a good proper diagnoses I can be super effective.

Do the people you work with receive treatment such as chemo from their doctors too?

Also, do you keep tabs on patients after they leave to keep records on the effectiveness of your treatments? (A common problem I see is people recording the successes but not the failures, aka confirmation bias)

It'd be interesting to compare the rates of survival and recurrence of your patients with that of the general population, as well. (Respecting individual doctor/patient confidentiality, of course) It would certainly give some information on which types of cancer your treatments are more/less effective on.

 

[titorite]

Yes, I always encourage folks to listen to their doctor. Most all of them use conventional therapies as well but I've had a few that refused anything conventional. I try to keep tabs on the folks I help but more often than not after it is all said and done the ones that live often lose contact with me... You'd think I'd get a Christmas card or something but no. I don't keep track of minor diseases but of my terminal clients my record is 3 for 3. Three lived, three did not. Of the three I lost they were all stage 4 so early intervention is preferable.