Islam
- Thread starter PyRo99
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Islam
I'm anti-zionist, which is not to be confused with anti-semitic or anti-Jewish. The Zionists are part of the neocon NWO movement. Hell, they invented the whole neocon movement. Being anti-zionist has nothing to do with religion or race, it's political, and moral IMO. The Zionists were in league with Hitler. Some of the first money used to start the beginnings of a Jewish state were from Hitler's govt. back in the 1930's. The Zionists, now calling themselves neocons, have hijacked the current administration and most of our federal politicians. Criticize the Israelis govt. and see how far that gets you in Washington D.C. The Israeli govt., run by Zionists IMO, have an undue influence in our federal govt. Look at the unfolding Pentagon-Israeli spy investigation. The FBI and Justice Dept. were going to make arrests the day the story broke, but Asscroft put a stop to it. Mossad agents and Israelis spies caught here are routinely released and allowed to return to Israel. Why? What special pass do they deserve? The Zionists got in bed with the ultra conservative right wing Christians because they're zealous (fanatical in my opinion) enough to believe that God wants them take over the planet for "His greater good". The same crap used to steal the country from the American Indians. Some of the most inhumane and cruel atrocities against humanity have been done in the name of God. I'm sure God wouldn't claim most of what has been done in His name. But let's move on to Islam.
The jihadists don't want you dead, personally because you're an American and a Christian. They want 1) our presence out of what they consider their holy land, and 2) they want us to stop supplying Israel with military equipment and backing. I'm in favor of both. Bring our troops home, stop meddling in places that are none of our business, and leave Israel to sink or swim on its own. The jihadists don't hate us because of our freedom and our way of life. That is part of the propaganda shoveled out by the Bushco neocons to get the American public behind an ongoing war of global conquest. The US has not been "over there" just to help out. The US has had all kinds of "black bag" operations going on around the globe for decades (ever since we came out as the predominant power following WW II). Our govt. has been responsible for assassinations, coup d'etats, terrorism and its financial support, arming dictators with weapons of mass destruction, participating in the illegal drug trade, weapon sales and supply to dictators, torture, and other brands of "bad acts" we constantly accuse others of doing. And that's just the stuff that's gotten out into the public domain. Of course, not many Americans want to acknowledge that we're just as guilty of wrong doing as those we accuse. My point is "we ain't the angels" that most people would like to believe we are. That's more why the jihadists "want us dead." Read up on Osama bin Laden's reasons for war against the U.S. and the west. That's pretty much what he laid out (top two points of this paragraph) in writings from the 1990's. BTW, Osama bin Laden is a bought and paid for "asset" of the CIA, as was Saddam Hussein, and Noriega, along with I'm sure would be an extensive list.
Our "country saving" days ended with WW II. Since then our govt. has been in the "country disruption for our own ends" business. It's hard to remember the favors you did for my parents, when all you've been doing for the past 60 years is jacking with me and mine. I agree that the U.N. and NATO should be abandoned by the U.S.
I don't know much about muslims or the Islamic faith. Just about any religion, taken to extremes and misinterpretations, you can come up with some lunacy and "justification" to commit the most heinous of atrocities. That's not limited to Islam. Been done by Christians for damned sure.
Cary
I'm anti-zionist, which is not to be confused with anti-semitic or anti-Jewish. The Zionists are part of the neocon NWO movement. Hell, they invented the whole neocon movement. Being anti-zionist has nothing to do with religion or race, it's political, and moral IMO. The Zionists were in league with Hitler. Some of the first money used to start the beginnings of a Jewish state were from Hitler's govt. back in the 1930's. The Zionists, now calling themselves neocons, have hijacked the current administration and most of our federal politicians. Criticize the Israelis govt. and see how far that gets you in Washington D.C. The Israeli govt., run by Zionists IMO, have an undue influence in our federal govt. Look at the unfolding Pentagon-Israeli spy investigation. The FBI and Justice Dept. were going to make arrests the day the story broke, but Asscroft put a stop to it. Mossad agents and Israelis spies caught here are routinely released and allowed to return to Israel. Why? What special pass do they deserve? The Zionists got in bed with the ultra conservative right wing Christians because they're zealous (fanatical in my opinion) enough to believe that God wants them take over the planet for "His greater good". The same crap used to steal the country from the American Indians. Some of the most inhumane and cruel atrocities against humanity have been done in the name of God. I'm sure God wouldn't claim most of what has been done in His name. But let's move on to Islam.
The jihadists don't want you dead, personally because you're an American and a Christian. They want 1) our presence out of what they consider their holy land, and 2) they want us to stop supplying Israel with military equipment and backing. I'm in favor of both. Bring our troops home, stop meddling in places that are none of our business, and leave Israel to sink or swim on its own. The jihadists don't hate us because of our freedom and our way of life. That is part of the propaganda shoveled out by the Bushco neocons to get the American public behind an ongoing war of global conquest. The US has not been "over there" just to help out. The US has had all kinds of "black bag" operations going on around the globe for decades (ever since we came out as the predominant power following WW II). Our govt. has been responsible for assassinations, coup d'etats, terrorism and its financial support, arming dictators with weapons of mass destruction, participating in the illegal drug trade, weapon sales and supply to dictators, torture, and other brands of "bad acts" we constantly accuse others of doing. And that's just the stuff that's gotten out into the public domain. Of course, not many Americans want to acknowledge that we're just as guilty of wrong doing as those we accuse. My point is "we ain't the angels" that most people would like to believe we are. That's more why the jihadists "want us dead." Read up on Osama bin Laden's reasons for war against the U.S. and the west. That's pretty much what he laid out (top two points of this paragraph) in writings from the 1990's. BTW, Osama bin Laden is a bought and paid for "asset" of the CIA, as was Saddam Hussein, and Noriega, along with I'm sure would be an extensive list.
Our "country saving" days ended with WW II. Since then our govt. has been in the "country disruption for our own ends" business. It's hard to remember the favors you did for my parents, when all you've been doing for the past 60 years is jacking with me and mine. I agree that the U.N. and NATO should be abandoned by the U.S.
I don't know much about muslims or the Islamic faith. Just about any religion, taken to extremes and misinterpretations, you can come up with some lunacy and "justification" to commit the most heinous of atrocities. That's not limited to Islam. Been done by Christians for damned sure.
Cary
Islam
Posted by Cary P.:
Cary, with all due respect, do you care to support these assertions with some facts? The Zionists in league with Hitler??? That's such a preposterous assertion that I really want your source material on it. Hitler was out to destroy Jews, not establish them.
And, if I might ask, where did this whole "neocon" thing come from? This is a word that has been bandied about for the past year or so and is used almost like a profanity these days to put people down. From what I understand, it became used when Jews decided to back away from the Democratic party because they realized they no longer agreed with any of the values that the Democrats held any more. Now they are demonized because of this. Just so you know, many Jews did not leave the Democratic Party, the Democratic Party left them. It went to the left, they stayed where they always had been. Now they are being branded as traitors under the word, "Neocon."
As to the Israeli spy in the Pentagon, I am sure we are going to hear about a conviction. Haven't you ever heard of the name Jonathan Pollard? He certainly wasn't given a "pass." In fact, the judge threw the book at him and gave him the harshest sentence handed out for any spy which had been caught in America up to that time. As to the fact that Israel has been spying on America, I don't like that it happens, but it happens in every country. China was caught spying on us in the late '90's and obtained all of our up to then technology for defense. Robert Hanssen spied for the Russians from the FBI. Things like this happen from time to time - unfortunately.
The "zionists" didn't "get into bed with the Conservatives" because "they're zealous (fanatical in my opinion) enough to believe that God wants them take over the planet for "His greater good;" they joined with those who shared similar values, when they discovered that the rest of the world is out to destroy their country's existence. Like it or not, the UN, Europe and many countries from around the world have a decidedly anti-Israel/pro Arab stance. They will fawn in obsequious ass-kissing to the Arabs and blast Israel should one Palestinian person's toe get stubbed as they cross through the security barriers. If the world is out to get you, you tend to draw closer to people who are supportive of you, not the ones that can't wait to see you die. And where in the world do you get your source material about the "Zionist's desire to take over the planet for "His greater good?" The Protocols of the Elders on Zion??? That is the type of source material that would assert such a ludicrous notion.
Lastly, do a search through the history of WWII and see exactly WHO supported Hitler in his war. It was the ARABS, not the Jews. The ARABS wanted Hitler to win. And if you look, you will discover that many of them bemoan the fact that he never finished his "Final Solution." What the Arabs didn't understand, however, because they didn't understand what Hitler really wanted for the world, is that had he gotten his way, the Arabs would have eventually been in those camps themselves. Hitler had no use for anyone who wasn't a blond-hair, blue eyed Aryan.
All of this is to say that even had Hitler given money to establish a Zionist entity, it was in order to get rid of the Jews out of Germany and for no other reason.
Posted by Cary P.:
Cary, with all due respect, do you care to support these assertions with some facts? The Zionists in league with Hitler??? That's such a preposterous assertion that I really want your source material on it. Hitler was out to destroy Jews, not establish them.
And, if I might ask, where did this whole "neocon" thing come from? This is a word that has been bandied about for the past year or so and is used almost like a profanity these days to put people down. From what I understand, it became used when Jews decided to back away from the Democratic party because they realized they no longer agreed with any of the values that the Democrats held any more. Now they are demonized because of this. Just so you know, many Jews did not leave the Democratic Party, the Democratic Party left them. It went to the left, they stayed where they always had been. Now they are being branded as traitors under the word, "Neocon."
As to the Israeli spy in the Pentagon, I am sure we are going to hear about a conviction. Haven't you ever heard of the name Jonathan Pollard? He certainly wasn't given a "pass." In fact, the judge threw the book at him and gave him the harshest sentence handed out for any spy which had been caught in America up to that time. As to the fact that Israel has been spying on America, I don't like that it happens, but it happens in every country. China was caught spying on us in the late '90's and obtained all of our up to then technology for defense. Robert Hanssen spied for the Russians from the FBI. Things like this happen from time to time - unfortunately.
The "zionists" didn't "get into bed with the Conservatives" because "they're zealous (fanatical in my opinion) enough to believe that God wants them take over the planet for "His greater good;" they joined with those who shared similar values, when they discovered that the rest of the world is out to destroy their country's existence. Like it or not, the UN, Europe and many countries from around the world have a decidedly anti-Israel/pro Arab stance. They will fawn in obsequious ass-kissing to the Arabs and blast Israel should one Palestinian person's toe get stubbed as they cross through the security barriers. If the world is out to get you, you tend to draw closer to people who are supportive of you, not the ones that can't wait to see you die. And where in the world do you get your source material about the "Zionist's desire to take over the planet for "His greater good?" The Protocols of the Elders on Zion??? That is the type of source material that would assert such a ludicrous notion.
Lastly, do a search through the history of WWII and see exactly WHO supported Hitler in his war. It was the ARABS, not the Jews. The ARABS wanted Hitler to win. And if you look, you will discover that many of them bemoan the fact that he never finished his "Final Solution." What the Arabs didn't understand, however, because they didn't understand what Hitler really wanted for the world, is that had he gotten his way, the Arabs would have eventually been in those camps themselves. Hitler had no use for anyone who wasn't a blond-hair, blue eyed Aryan.
All of this is to say that even had Hitler given money to establish a Zionist entity, it was in order to get rid of the Jews out of Germany and for no other reason.
Unintentional
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Islam
I don't know if Zionist were in league with Hitler, but A LOT of aid (in the form of money) sent to Palestine (I don't know if we still send aid to Palestine) ultimately gets split up (to the detriment of the Palestinian people) between Israel and only ONE Palistinian, Arafat.
I said this once on the other board and it got deleted, but it is absolutely true: When persia changed it's name to Iran, they were sending a message to Hitler that they too were of the Aryan Nation. Iran is muslim for Land of Aryans.
I don't know if Zionist were in league with Hitler, but A LOT of aid (in the form of money) sent to Palestine (I don't know if we still send aid to Palestine) ultimately gets split up (to the detriment of the Palestinian people) between Israel and only ONE Palistinian, Arafat.
I said this once on the other board and it got deleted, but it is absolutely true: When persia changed it's name to Iran, they were sending a message to Hitler that they too were of the Aryan Nation. Iran is muslim for Land of Aryans.
Islam
Talk...Talk...Talk. Everyone has their opinion and theory, but what can we really do to solve this problem? Sending aid doesn't seem to help, sending troops doesn't seem to help, sitting back and watching doesn't seem to help. I feel somewhat discouraged that there is no real solution. Now they are saying that al Qaeda was linked to the tragedy in Russia. For every radical that is killed it seems that there are two to take the empty place. Our violence against them only adds to their numbers and their desires to destroy us and our nation. These people have no honor or decency when they kill innocent people such as the children in Russia. So what is the answer?
Karizma
Talk...Talk...Talk. Everyone has their opinion and theory, but what can we really do to solve this problem? Sending aid doesn't seem to help, sending troops doesn't seem to help, sitting back and watching doesn't seem to help. I feel somewhat discouraged that there is no real solution. Now they are saying that al Qaeda was linked to the tragedy in Russia. For every radical that is killed it seems that there are two to take the empty place. Our violence against them only adds to their numbers and their desires to destroy us and our nation. These people have no honor or decency when they kill innocent people such as the children in Russia. So what is the answer?
Karizma
sosuemetoo
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- 723
Islam
I do understand that we did support Osama at one time. That was not when he was screaming death to the infidels. This was when Russia, a communist country, was invading Afganistan.
If they didn't want our presense, then why are those in the UN so quick to ask the US to go in and help Africa and the Middle East? African and Middle Eastern nations vote for our presence!
As for that area of the world being an Islamic holy land....it is also a Christian and Jewish holy land. These religions were all born in that area. Why can't we all live there, instead of just the Muslims? Why do we have countries like Iran that are Islamic nations? Why can't it be a democracy with freedom to worship God, Allah or a grain of sand?
I believe we should stop supporting Isreal, then fundementalist muslims stop sending their children in with a strap on bomb and blowing up a busload of people and feeling like a martyr when they do so.
Lastly, I do believe the jihadists want me dead personally. When I see signs and spoken word saying "death to the infidels" (Infidel is a non-muslim) "death to America", that speaks to me loud and clear what their intentions are. They want death to every religion except Islam. If it weren't true, then why (once again) are their Islamic nations that do not allow any freedom of religion?
I do understand that we did support Osama at one time. That was not when he was screaming death to the infidels. This was when Russia, a communist country, was invading Afganistan.
If they didn't want our presense, then why are those in the UN so quick to ask the US to go in and help Africa and the Middle East? African and Middle Eastern nations vote for our presence!
As for that area of the world being an Islamic holy land....it is also a Christian and Jewish holy land. These religions were all born in that area. Why can't we all live there, instead of just the Muslims? Why do we have countries like Iran that are Islamic nations? Why can't it be a democracy with freedom to worship God, Allah or a grain of sand?
I believe we should stop supporting Isreal, then fundementalist muslims stop sending their children in with a strap on bomb and blowing up a busload of people and feeling like a martyr when they do so.
Lastly, I do believe the jihadists want me dead personally. When I see signs and spoken word saying "death to the infidels" (Infidel is a non-muslim) "death to America", that speaks to me loud and clear what their intentions are. They want death to every religion except Islam. If it weren't true, then why (once again) are their Islamic nations that do not allow any freedom of religion?
Islam
I know the exchange between CaryP and pauli looks a little heated but I believe it is because both have LOTS of info to support their positions.
I think their positions can and should be brought out slowly, including their sources. I think a lot can be learned on both sides from such a dialogue.
I know there is also a lot of charged emotions involved in this. So let us try to be respectful and understanding of mistakes and differences.
I do have a take on a solution Karizma but wont offer it right now. My solution is decidedly biased and I wish this dialogue to emerge first.
I know the exchange between CaryP and pauli looks a little heated but I believe it is because both have LOTS of info to support their positions.
I think their positions can and should be brought out slowly, including their sources. I think a lot can be learned on both sides from such a dialogue.
I know there is also a lot of charged emotions involved in this. So let us try to be respectful and understanding of mistakes and differences.
I do have a take on a solution Karizma but wont offer it right now. My solution is decidedly biased and I wish this dialogue to emerge first.
sosuemetoo
Active Member
- Messages
- 723
Islam
You are so right Phoenix. I keep wanting to put a disclaimer in my signature:
"I do not hate Islam. I believe that Islam, Christianity, Judaism and all other religions can live in peace and harmony with one another.
I am however terrified of the Jihadists and fundementalist muslims. I wish they would allow us to worship in anyway we see fit and not kill innocent people who may (or may not) agree with their views on the Koran."
/sorry, won't fit in the signature line provided
You are so right Phoenix. I keep wanting to put a disclaimer in my signature:
"I do not hate Islam. I believe that Islam, Christianity, Judaism and all other religions can live in peace and harmony with one another.
I am however terrified of the Jihadists and fundementalist muslims. I wish they would allow us to worship in anyway we see fit and not kill innocent people who may (or may not) agree with their views on the Koran."
/sorry, won't fit in the signature line provided
Islam
Pauli,
You believe what you want to believe. The Zionists are anti-Semitic. The Zionists are part of the NWO. Zionists are also part of the neocons, which have hijacked the Republican party and the current administration. The neocons were liberal Democrats who saw that they could get their agenda better attained by aligning themselves with fundamental Christians of the religious right. Fundamentalism breeds fanaticism. The neocons put their agenda in public view through their organization the Project for the New American Century (PNAC). Part of their plan was to have a "Pearl Harbor" type event to get the American people behind ongoing global war to achieve their "Pax Americana" or American styled governments around the world, but controlled centrally. There are Jews who hate the Zionists because of their evil goals.
I am not anti-Semitic or anti-Jewish. I have several friends who are Jewish. I have taken a rash of crap at my local country club for hanging out with them and bringing them to the club. I had a very wealthy club member sign up as a client, only to find out he was very racist against Jews. I fired him as a client and closed his account. I got the same crap for bringing black friends to the club. I have since quit the elitist and racist country club. But then again, most of the clubs are down here.
I am not a liberal. I tend to be fairly conservative in politics. I have never voted for a Democrat, voting Republican most of my life, but not any more.
The neocons and the Zionists have hijacked most of our federally elected officials. The Israeli govt. is controlled by Zionists, and exercises undue influence over the US govt. Try getting elected to a federal office and speaking out against the Israeli govt. and you probably won't get too far. So, most of our federally elected officials are blindly supportive of the Israeli govt. because of the campaign money that AIPAC throws around. Politicians being whores for campaign money is all it is. Did you know that several members of the White House administration have dual citizenships with Israel and are members of Sharon's Likud party? Where do you think their loyalties lie? It ain't here. These same people are also founding members of PNAC along with VP Cheney, Sec. of Defense Rumsfeld.
I'd give you more details, but you sound like you need to do some research for yourself. Try google on the topics you seem upset about. I'm providing some links below to get you started.
Zionism - What is the Biblical View?
PNAC home page
US Neoconservatives
Yes, they call themselves neocons. I didn't make up the name, they named themselves.
Jews Against Zionism
Now, I don't want to get into a pissing contest with you, but you might want to get better informed before you get your feelings hurt, or your ire up again. I figured my post might strike a few nerves. Wake up call is what I'd call it.
Cary
Pauli,
You believe what you want to believe. The Zionists are anti-Semitic. The Zionists are part of the NWO. Zionists are also part of the neocons, which have hijacked the Republican party and the current administration. The neocons were liberal Democrats who saw that they could get their agenda better attained by aligning themselves with fundamental Christians of the religious right. Fundamentalism breeds fanaticism. The neocons put their agenda in public view through their organization the Project for the New American Century (PNAC). Part of their plan was to have a "Pearl Harbor" type event to get the American people behind ongoing global war to achieve their "Pax Americana" or American styled governments around the world, but controlled centrally. There are Jews who hate the Zionists because of their evil goals.
I am not anti-Semitic or anti-Jewish. I have several friends who are Jewish. I have taken a rash of crap at my local country club for hanging out with them and bringing them to the club. I had a very wealthy club member sign up as a client, only to find out he was very racist against Jews. I fired him as a client and closed his account. I got the same crap for bringing black friends to the club. I have since quit the elitist and racist country club. But then again, most of the clubs are down here.
I am not a liberal. I tend to be fairly conservative in politics. I have never voted for a Democrat, voting Republican most of my life, but not any more.
The neocons and the Zionists have hijacked most of our federally elected officials. The Israeli govt. is controlled by Zionists, and exercises undue influence over the US govt. Try getting elected to a federal office and speaking out against the Israeli govt. and you probably won't get too far. So, most of our federally elected officials are blindly supportive of the Israeli govt. because of the campaign money that AIPAC throws around. Politicians being whores for campaign money is all it is. Did you know that several members of the White House administration have dual citizenships with Israel and are members of Sharon's Likud party? Where do you think their loyalties lie? It ain't here. These same people are also founding members of PNAC along with VP Cheney, Sec. of Defense Rumsfeld.
I'd give you more details, but you sound like you need to do some research for yourself. Try google on the topics you seem upset about. I'm providing some links below to get you started.
Zionism - What is the Biblical View?
PNAC home page
US Neoconservatives
Yes, they call themselves neocons. I didn't make up the name, they named themselves.
Jews Against Zionism
Now, I don't want to get into a pissing contest with you, but you might want to get better informed before you get your feelings hurt, or your ire up again. I figured my post might strike a few nerves. Wake up call is what I'd call it.
Cary