Waco Event. What Could It Be?

[Snow]

Waco Event. What Could It Be?

OK I get your meaning. I guess I disagree.

I think we are living in the ultimate Waco-style event, we're just waiting for the hammer to drop.

First we have the present governments propensity for tyranny, then it's self granted powers to control resistance to it, then the small uses of that power, then the "WTF just happened" by citizens, (<------ this where are right now and we are moving here ---->) then the organization of themselves by those citizens, then the governments broader application of the governments illegal legal rights to defend itself against it's citizens, then the armed resistance by the citizens and OOPS - Waco-Events? No - the beginning of the "Civil War".

That is why I think we are in the Waco-event and everytime the Patriot Act is "used" or Homeland Security "acts" it is a Waco-style event.

Anyway - I guess I got it wrong but that is how I see it.

Ready to be re-educated . . .

OMG - did I say that?

SFW

 

[Smooth-Operator]

Waco Event. What Could It Be?

:::Smooth unruffles her feathers and climbs off soapbox:::

Okay, I just hate labels and I was about out of Troll Repellant spray.

The dumbest thing (well one of them) that happens to me frequently when some non-Bush supporters realises I'm a Christian, they start treating me as if they need to send me to some wacko farm.
'oh:

Okay.... okay... back on topic....

Ok, I'd say it is a pollitically motivated attack on a dissident citizen's group where the citizen's group resists with armed force. and to sound technical one or more of the following factors are present.

#1 The government conducts the raid in a way that makes it clear that they are trying to kill the dissidents not arrest them and bring them before a jury of their peers.

#2 The government uses heavy weapons, armored vehicles, attack aircraft or other things formerly reserved for our forign enemies.

#3 The government uses any non lethal mass weapon in such a way that they must have known or should have known would make it lethal.

#4 The government uses a heavy propaganda campaign to demonize their targets. (look for rural groups to be dubbed \"white supremicist\" alot. In fact look at what is being said about Ranch Rescue, and other border defense groups right now.)

Didn't JT say something about a build up and breaking down of Constitutional rights and other freedoms, until the lid blows off .

With the media blacking out the protests nationally there's a rumor about a massive Protest on inauguration day. Now, that's something that the media wont be able to black out, and should be interesting to see how Inauguratiion day unfolds.


I predict the actual event will happen then.

PS- DW, nice to know yer not a Govt. Troll :lol:

@);- Smooth @);-

 

[Darkwolf]

Waco Event. What Could It Be?

Didn't JT say something about a build up and breaking down of Constitutional rights and other freedoms, until the lid blows off .

Yeagh, he did. And I hear it ratteling. Wether this election really was shady or not, we'll find out in the next couple of weeks. I heard that there is a movement that may have some legs that could well challange the results in 34 states. May just be the left whining beacause they lost though.

As to the loss of constitutional rights, that would have to come out in the major media. So far the patriot act is just a boogy man under the bed. Not much personal consiquence for the average Joe or Jane.

I posted a couple of news articles on the other Waco threads that I'd like to hear what people think about. Especially the F-16 thing, Weird.

With the media blacking out the protests nationally there's a rumor about a massive Protest on inauguration day. Now, that's something that the media wont be able to black out, and should be interesting to see how Inauguratiion day unfolds.

I have a bad feeling about that too. I tend to think that somone in the protesting crowd is going to do something violent which prompts a government response. Expect to hear more from our masked effegy burners too.

 

[Smooth-Operator]

Waco Event. What Could It Be?

Looks like things are already startin to heat up a bit with Ohio Voters storming the
state Capital

Outrage in Ohio: Angry residents storm State House in response to massive voter suppression

Hundreds of angry Ohio residents marched through the streets of Columbus Ohio's Capital this evening and stormed the Ohio State House, defying orders and arrest threats from Ohio State Troopers. \"O-H-I-O ! suppressed democracy has got to go,\"they chanted. After troopers pushed and scuffled with people, nearly a hundred people took over the steps and entrance to the State's giant white column capital building and refused repeated orders to disperse or face arrest. People prepared for arrests, ready to face jail writing lawyers phone numbers on their arms, signing jail support lists and discussing non-cooperation and active resistance (linking arms, but not fighting back).

Another excerpt...

The Ohio state House takeover was the culmination of an eight-hour long afternoon of protest at the state capitol by Ohio student and youth groups (The Columbus and Toledo Leagues of Pissed Off Voters, and Reach Out-Bowling Green) together with Columbus residents followed by a 300 strong 6pm march led by the Central Ohio Peace Network. The earlier speak-out featured a litany of people who experienced or witnessed voter suppression, intimidation and disenfranchisement before and during the election. Thousand of Ohio voters had been disenfranchised by partisan poll challengers, intimidation incidents, polling places opening late, lines up to four and five hours long -- often in the rain.

Rest of the Article

Once again, FOX misses the whole scoop. 'oh:

@);- ~ Smooth ~ @);-

 

[Darkwolf]

Waco Event. What Could It Be?

That headline about gave me a heart attack. My Mom works in that building.
If the students get into it, I can see where their more conservative parents might if they are getting hurt, killed or dissapearing too. It looks like titor may have called it after all.

 

[Smooth-Operator]

Waco Event. What Could It Be?

Originally posted by Darkwolf@Nov 6 2004, 10:39 PM
That headline about gave me a heart attack. My Mom works in that building.
If the students get into it, I can see where their more conservative parents might if they are getting hurt, killed or dissapearing too. It looks like titor may have called it after all.

​

Damn! Your mom works there?
'oh: Ya know we really have to do somethin about our media.

Looks like we're inching along, folks. In the meantime, I'm gonna go take a shower.

Niters

~ @);- Smooth ~ @);-

 

[Darkwolf]

Waco Event. What Could It Be?

Damn! Your mom works there?
Ya know we really have to do somethin about our media.

Looks like we're inching along, folks. In the meantime, I'm gonna go take a shower

Yeah, my mom went out and joined them :dry: aging hippies, what're you gonna do.

I'm not really sure inching is the word I'd use.

 

[Smooth-Operator]

Waco Event. What Could It Be?

I'm not really sure inching is the word I'd use.

Yeah, I guess it's more of a runaway train at this point.

'oh:

~Smooth~ @);-

 

[Ralan]

Waco Event. What Could It Be?

A Waco-type event is a situation of a physically violent conflict between a significant group of non-authority civilians and a group of authority figures, such as the army, the FBI or other government administration, in which the government administration is severely in the wrong; it will most often involve the deaths a number of innocent citizens. Another important factor is that the government will deny their involvement or the event entirely; if they do not, it is not a Waco-type event, it is civil administrative conflict.

It certainly has nothing to do with any particular segment of the population, i.e, certain cults or religions; the Branch Davidian massacre was just coincidentally cult based. And whatever the allegations against Koresh may have been, the children living inside that complex did not deserve to die at the hands of the government supposedly protecting them. The FBI actually stated that the charge against Koresh was based on acts of child abuse; if this is true, why were they prepared to kill the children to have Koresh dead? The truth is Koresh's supposed analysis of the Six and Seventh Seals from the bible, and the principles being uncovered involved strong opposition to the manner of Government in the United States: the Branch Davidians were far greater in number than many people think; there are Branch Davidians in Canada and even a few living in the Central Americas; that spread out. There were thousands in the states. The FBI probably knew even more than we can, and had him put out of action before his influence could reach these followers across the country. It doesn't matter that innocent people died in that building at the hands of the government; the Branch Davidians under Koresh was a threat to them and they made sure the leader and his writings disappeared before the threat could become a reality.

 

[Smooth-Operator]

Waco Event. What Could It Be?

Okay here's another... I was going to post something else but this seemed to catch my eye.

Crowd control revamped

Article Last Updated: Monday, November 08, 2004 - 6:09:07 AM PST
Oakland police revise policies in settlement of lawsuit over use of improper munitions

By Heather MacDonald, STAFF WRITER

OAKLAND -- The police department agreed Friday to revamp its crowd-control policy to settle part of a lawsuit that accused officers of opening fire on anti-war demonstrators in April 2003 with \"less-than-lethal\" munitions.

Under terms of the agreement, police officers will no longer be allowed to fire stinger grenades or wooden dowels to control crowds, such as the one that protested the invasion of Iraq at the Port of Oakland.

Nearly 60 protesters and dockworkers alleged the Oakland Police Department violated their civil rights by using excessive force to control the demonstration designed to highlight the role APL played in shipping munitions and other materials used in the war.

\"We're going to take it slower,\" said Police Chief Richard L. Word. \"We'll give a deliberate and clear order to disperse, tell the crowd where to go and what will happen if they don't.\"

Those who refuse to disperse when ordered will be arrested. If the crowd remains out of control, police can use batons to push the crowd back, according to the policy.

If that is also unsuccessful, only then can police use \"less-than-lethal\" weapons, including bean bag rounds and gas. Even then, the bean bag rounds must be targeted at individuals who pose a significant threat, and only if they do not endanger other members of the crowd or bystanders.

\"At least on paper, the policy should prevent what happened at the port from happening again,\" said Michael Haddad, an Oakland attorney who represents the plaintiffs, along with John Burris and Jim Chanin.

Burris said the policy will allow police to maintain order while respecting people's First Amendment rights to protest.

\"Just having a plan will make a difference,\" Burris said. \"There are ways to handle innocent people caught up in the crowd. Not all of them are criminals.\"

In addition, the department will designate officers as protest liaisons and have them meet with group leaders in advance of the demonstration to map out a plan of action, according to the policy.

Many protesters were hit in the back as they retreated from lines of riot gear-clad police on motorcycles and on foot. One woman was hit in the jaw, while a dockworker outside the gates was hit in the hand and needed surgery to repair his broken thumb.

Willow Rosenthal, 33, of West Oakland was hit in the back of the right calf with a wooden pellet. The founder of City Slicker Farms has incurred $80,000 in doctors' bills and undergone several surgeries for internal bleeding and skin grafts.

A year and a half later, Rosenthal is still in pain and grappling with emotional scars left by the altercation, but said she is pleased with the new policy, which she called comprehensive.

\"It's sad that it took this for them to do what is right,\" Rosenthal said.

The revamped policy does not include recommendations made by the Citizens' Police Review Board last week. The members urged the police department to ensure paramedics and ambulances are standing by if gas is to be used, to think twice before using gas near occupied buildings, and to consider the age, health and mobility of those present.

Those suggestions were simply made too late, Word said. Pepper spray may not be used to control or disperse crowds, he added.

The chief said he worked with several of his top commanders to ensure the policy is implemented, despite his plan to leave Oakland later this month for the top law enforcement job in Vacaville.

Officer Bob Valladon, president of the Oakland Police Officers Association, objected only to the prohibition on using motorcycles to control crowds by \"bumping\" people.

\"We need that technique,\" Valladon said. \"When people see a motorcycle coming toward them, they move.\"

While both city officials and the plaintiffs praised the revamped crowd-control policy, negotiations are still underway on a monetary settlement for the plaintiffs.

\"They haven't offered anything remotely fair,\" Haddad said.

The revised policy should not be viewed as an admission police overreacted or deliberately attacked protesters or dockworkers caught up in the demonstration, Word said.

Criminal charges against 24 activists and one longshoreman were dropped earlier this year. Several groups returned to the port on the first anniversary of the protest for a peaceful demonstration.

City officials have defended the actions of the officers, saying the order to open fire with wooden pellets, bean bag rounds and stinger grenades was given after protesters blocked traffic at the port and began throwing rocks and bottles at the officers.

However, a video of the confrontation released by the city does not show demonstrators attacking police.

The California Anti-Terrorism Information Center warned Oakland police to be prepared for violence at the protest, leading many to speculate the police officers arrived with a hair-trigger mentality.

Jennifer Hansen, 33, of San Francisco, who was hit once in the back of her arm with a projectile at the protest, said the new policy is a huge victory for activists in the Bay Area.

\"With (President) Bush's re-election, we have a lot of work to do,\" Hansen said.
Crowd Control Article

I remember when this happened and I remember being mortified.

~ @);- Smooth @);- ~