Debate John Titor: Real Time Traveler or a Hoaxer?

[HDRKID]

Re: John Titor Debate!

Hi Starlord:

And I thought I was the only victim of your sword, or is that pen?

Personally I like John Titor, he is the one who got me interested in time travel, in fact I would not have bought the HDR if it were not for the lively discussions of life after the war. I wanted to see for myself.

What John Titor talked about was a civil war first and then a limited nuclear war. Not to knock John but I do not see a limited nuclear war. :scared:

 

[PapaSmurph]

Re: John Titor Debate!

The idea of the United States collapsing into an anarchistic mess really isn't that far fetched. It fact, it's nearly inevitable. The world has been positioning the U.S. for the greatest fall of all time, and no one seems to know it. As the Soviet Union declined, the new international economy took shape around the dominant power, the U.S. But, while the U.S. remained prosperous, rich, and powerful thourghout this time, it did not control the keys to its own destiny, which lie in the halls of international finance. The reigns lay in the hands of China and Europe, the controllers of the world's largest issuers of bonds to U.S. companies and government institutions. Instead of using these bonds as a choke hold, the international banks have allowed the U.S. to gorge itself on economic growth, becoming the wealthiest nation ever to exist, with most of its riches stored away in intangible monetary funds and bonds that are easily transferred from one database to another. Now, as the U.S. grew, the banks shaped our growth, taking away manufacturies and infrastructure, making the U.S. more and more a place where people buy and sell themselves into oblivion, nothing more, giving us nothing but more money in return. A country that grows weaker daily should experience more stress than we have, especially as their currency devalues, but the Dollar has remained strong and stable for 1 reason, the Petrodollar. When the international banks, the same ones who issued all those bonds to the U.S., tell OPEC their credit rating depends on their ability to switch to a PetroEuro or PetroYen standard, and also decide this is a convenient time to pull the rug from under the U.S. debt structure... chaos seems like an understatement. The U.S. government will be forced to choose between defying the will of the world that they should die in order to shield its people from utter economic collapse, or accept its fate as the ultimate mark and have its pockets emptied, permanently. It would be permanent, too. With our currency on par with the Peso, our stock market crashed, with every instution broke and unable to find new credit, with the trillions in investment capitol the banks just received to buy out the valuable commodity of technological patents, brand names, and corporate bodies from the desperate, debt-ridden Americans, nothing would be able to pull us out of the depression that would ensue. One of John's comments was that the U.S. has 0 friends in the near and distant future, this seems like a decent reason to me.

 

[Passive_Extremist]

Re: John Titor Debate!

I'd just like to add this....

Toddler killed by LAPD bullet

LOS ANGELES, California (CNN) -- The 19-month-old toddler who died during a gunfire exchange between police and her father was killed by a single police bullet to the head, the Los Angeles County coroner said Wednesday.

The report said it came from a Los Angeles Police Department officer's rifle.

The girl's father, Jose Raul Pena, died as a result of multiple gunshot wounds, the coroner said.

Pena, 34, was holding his daughter Suzy when he opened fire on police last Sunday, unleashing 40 shots in three separate exchanges. He and his daughter died in a hail of gunfire after he confronted police in an alley behind his apartment.

A total of 11 officers fired nearly 90 shots at Pena.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/07/13/toddler.s....shooting/index...

phew, good thing those cops just doing their jobs protected themselves..

 

[Apogee]

Re: John Titor Debate!

Passive, that link doesn't work.


Someone put my thoughts on this quite well on another board...

"Law enforcement officers are like a cross segment of any other profession in America. Most are good people trying to do a difficult job, some are bad, most are heroes some are criminals.
That said, we don't know exactly what happened at the scene yet and until we do, it's hard to say. I'm sure there was a designated shooter, and probably a sniper as well. In a perfect world, negotitations would have continued until the suspect surrendered peacefully. That didn't happen.

Taking a single, well-aimed, instantly incapactiating shot would have been the next best option. That's nearly impossible even when the suspect is cooperating and not moving and shooting.

In this case, if the reports are correct, the suspect was firing and had fired 40 rounds (Which could be part of the 90 the family says the police fired) in three separate engagements. He needed to be stopped so I would have ordered my best shooters to end the situation. I don't think for one minute there's a cop out there who would be happy to shoot an 18 month old child, and regardless of how this turns out, they did a tough job and ended an extremely dangerous situation. Some of them may never recover completely emotionally from what they just participated in.

There will always be room to monday morning quarterback any critical incident, and there will always be valid criticisms of any police shooting, but we don't have the benefit of 20/20 hindsight as the incident is happening."

And again, you DON'T know the circumstances. For all you know, the guy may have been advancing on the cop he'd wounded with the express purpose of finishing the job. If I was that downed cops partners then I would be in an impossible situation. Would I not take a risk in preserving the life of a guy I'd worked with for years, whose wife and family were friends I cared about?

If the kid was hit by a single bullet, it sounds like some poor cop made an unlucky shot trying to bring the guy down. If you believe the mother of the kid the cops fired "like 300 shots" but as you say, we shouldn't believe everything we read, especially if the child died from a single bullet. Remember, there were three seperate occasions when these cops came under fire until one of them was hit so to say they didn't show restraint is untrue

How about this nugget from CNN:

"It was the second time in nine months that Los Angeles officers have fired on an assailant holding a hostage. In November, police shot a man who held a pregnant woman by the neck outside the Mexican Consulate. Officers pulled the woman away unharmed and the man later died."

I suppose if that maniac had killed the pregnant woman and some other innocent bystander you would complain how they'd been incompetant allowing them to die and should have tried shooting the guy when they had the chance.

Some mad gunman uses a baby as human shield, shoots at the cops on three seperate occasions, the kid dies and of course its the cop's fault.

 

[Passive_Extremist]

Re: John Titor Debate!

I suppose if it had been your kid , you'd be singing a different song.

 

[Apogee]

Re: John Titor Debate!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(\"Passive_Extremist\")</div>

I suppose if it had been your kid , you'd be singing a different song.[/b]

If the pregnant woman had been your wife you'd be singing a different tune, too.

 

[StarLord]

Re: John Titor Debate!

Hind Sight is always 20-20. Too often the police get blamed either way the ball bounces.

Passive, if you were a policeman there at that scene, what would you have done?

 

[Apogee]

Re: John Titor Debate!

Passive, if you were a policeman there at that scene, what would you have done?[/QUOTE]

Well, I hate to throw rocks but he's already said what he'd have done in a previous post - throw rocks!

 

[Passive_Extremist]

Re: John Titor Debate!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(\"StarLord\")</div>

Hind Sight is always 20-20. ?Too often the police get blamed either way the ball bounces. ?

Passive, ?if you were a policeman there at that scene, ?what would you have done?[/b]

Put the gunman on a couch and gave him therapy.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(\"Apogee\")</div>

If the pregnant woman had been your wife you'd be singing a different tune, too.[/b]

What's that have to do with them gunning down a baby? I think some cops do some good things, I don't think they're all bad. However I don't think they have a blank check when it comes to blowing people away.

 

[StarLord]

Re: John Titor Debate!

"Put the gunman on a couch and gave him therapy"

Interesting. Of course that's assuming that you happen to be precognitive and knew that he would freakout, loose all sense of right and wrong, go out and do what he did.
That would be a neat trick. Since no one employed by society that is connected with law enforcement can read the future, that is not a viable choice after the fact is it?

What would you do if you were there in the thick of things, you are dodgeing the crazed gunmans bullets, your partner just got shot. More of your friends on the force could be shot at anytime. Innocent bystanders could be killed at anytime IF you do not stop this person. Forget rocks. What would you do?