🛡️ Debate Stephen Hawking makes it clear: There is no God

[Harte]

And you keep saying "Your" God. If you really don't believe in God then why even say "Your God"?

Just a couple of points to add here.

1) The disbelief in any supernatural deity does not preclude the use of a common noun in a properly constructed sentence. In the following:

I believe your god doesn't exist, just as I believe Thor, Vishnu and all of the others don't exist.

it is clear that Ayasano properly selected an appropriate noun to communicate his meaning. Because the god of Abraham is not associated with any form of idolatry, the word "god" here (lower case) was appropriate, if the Abrahamic god was to be included in the list (i.e., the word "idol" can't be used here to convey the same meaning.) The use of any other appropriate term (Yahweh, "Jesus," "Tetragrammaton," etc.) would elicit the same meaningless argument from you concerning the selection of a noun, would it not?


2) Does the use of a term indicate that one believes in the reality of the thing described by that term? If so, I ask the moderators to delete every post I have ever made that wherein I used the term "Atlantis." The point is, your argument (quoted above) is utterly vacant and constitutes a blatant waste of electronic storage space, not to mention the time used by any readers of the post.

Harte

 

[titorite]

If he doesn't believe in God With all honesty then he should not feel I have a God anymore than he does. Their for his use of the statement "YOUR GOD" is indicative of the notion that he just may believe a little bit in God or that I have a God that he doesn't have. It does not indicate the belief that nobody has any God because their is no God. Atheists have religious issues.

 

[Ayasano]

If he doesn't believe in God With all honesty then he should not feel I have a God anymore than he does. Their for his use of the statement "YOUR GOD" is indicative of the notion that he just may believe a little bit in God or that I have a God that he doesn't have. It does not indicate the belief that nobody has any God because their is no God. Atheists have religious issues.

Just for the sake of clearing up your confusion, I'll reply to this. I don't believe in any gods or goddesses. Therefore I don't believe the god you believe in exists. I don't believe any of the gods or goddesses anyone believes in exists. As Harte mentioned above, saying "your god" (note the lower case, grammar matters here) is just to differentiate from all of the other gods or goddesses I am also referring to. I'll restate this just to make it clear for you. I believe no gods or goddesses exist. At all. None. Are we clear on this now?

So, I do not have "religious issues". I'm not the one trying to tell someone else what they believe. I think it's fine for you to believe in whatever you want to believe in, that's one of your basic human rights. Just like it's fine for me to believe no gods or goddesses exist. (Though I should refrain from saying they definitely don't exist when that hasn't been proven for sure, regardless of what I believe in, because I want to be respectful of your beliefs)

 

[titorite]

So, I do not have "religious issues". I'm not the one trying to tell someone else what they believe. I think it's fine for you to believe in whatever you want to believe in, that's one of your basic human rights. Just like it's fine for me to believe no gods or goddesses exist. (Though I should refrain from saying they definitely don't exist when that hasn't been proven for sure, regardless of what I believe in, because I want to be respectful of your beliefs)

Yes you are, You don't use words like maybe or perhaps, no you use definitives like "you think this" or "You believe That" Or "you said atheists hate life" when I never said that.

You have attempted several times to tell me what I believe.

Just read over your own words. You don't know what I believe , but you don't seem too concerned about it either. You only seem concerned with what YOU believe and telling others what you THINK they believe.

 

[Einstein]

I believe you all are entitled to your incorrect and unverifiable beliefs.

 

[Ayasano]

So, I do not have "religious issues". I'm not the one trying to tell someone else what they believe. I think it's fine for you to believe in whatever you want to believe in, that's one of your basic human rights. Just like it's fine for me to believe no gods or goddesses exist. (Though I should refrain from saying they definitely don't exist when that hasn't been proven for sure, regardless of what I believe in, because I want to be respectful of your beliefs)

Yes you are, You don't use words like maybe or perhaps, no you use definitives like "you think this" or "You believe That" Or "you said atheists hate life" when I never said that.

You have attempted several times to tell me what I believe.

Just read over your own words. You don't know what I believe , but you don't seem too concerned about it either. You only seem concerned with what YOU believe and telling others what you THINK they believe.

Please do me the courtesy of quoting where I actually said that, like I did for you, because looking back I don't see anywhere where I told you what you believe.

 

[Ayasano]

I believe you all are entitled to your incorrect and unverifiable beliefs.

I think the day we manage to verify things one way or the other is the day the last war on Earth will end.

 

[titorite]

. Your assertion that your god is their god and that they have to believe in your god is just plain arrogant.

I did not say they have to believe that.

And I think this is where I bow out of this discussion. When your debate partner starts to twist your own words and outright lie about and ignore what they themselves said, it's time to accept that they aren't open to discussion any more. And he has the gall to say the atheist is the problem.

You have not bowed out of the conversation , I have not out right lied , and if you feel I twisted your words then that is on you for speaking what you said not me for quoting your own words, and I said atheists have issues NOT ATHEIST IS THE PROBLEM. Be exact.

To hate something, you have to believe it exists, which atheists by definition don't. You're basically saying that he has to actively hate every single god or goddess ever conceived in order to not believe in them, which is obviously a fallacy. Remember that your god is not the only possible god

I am not saying he believes in multiples gods or that he has to believe in such a thing you put those words out there. I did not say them. I am saying he despises God period. AND you don't know MY god. So for you to say to me that I should remember that my god is not the only possible god is extremely arrogant. A BIG ASSUMPTION. For I am thinking the only God. and you are thinking god god god god no god. Only the way you talk... It leads me to think you doubt your faith in godlessness. But not enough to admit to it. But make no mistake I am not saying hawkings hates thor and krishnia and allah, I am just theorizing that the man has a hatred of God.

not everyone believes in the same thing as you. The Abrahamic god is only one of many that people believe in. Your assertion that your god is their god and that they have to believe in

Bad assumption and shame on you for telling me I believe in burning bushes and that the infinity told abraham to kill issac. I'm a little more complicated then that but you didn't care, you just presumed and sought to pick an argument. Issues.
Not problems, Issues.

You don't even care to ask me what exactly I believe, you already have a retort ready for what you THINK I believe but you haven't even examined my beliefs.

 

[ElementalDissonance]

AND you don't know MY god. So for you to say to me that I should remember that my god is not the only possible god is extremely arrogant. A BIG ASSUMPTION. For I am thinking the only God. and you are thinking god god god god no god.

I see no other way to talk about the plethora of gods that certain people believe in than through capitalization and saying "other gods".

Personally, I believe in many gods, and I also believe there is only one God. I also believe there are no gods. An Islamic friend told me that it's impossible to believe all three, and I responded, "How can it be impossible if I believe it?"

To me, it seems like you're both arguing opposite sides of the same coin.

Now... If only we could design some kind of three-sided hyper-coin... Hmm.

Not problems, Issues.

I fail to see the difference. Care to explain?

 

[titorite]

A problem can be solved. Issues just go on and on and one till resolved.